The past couple of days Pastor Stephen Strader of Lakeland's Ignited Church of the Assemblies of God has been trading e-mails with me regarding my "Open Letter" and about what is happening in Lakeland. Pastor Strader's Ignited Church started the meetings with Todd Bentley that have now become the "Florida Outpouring". (Revealing info about Ignited Church in that link as well.)
Of the several letters I sent, I honestly was least expecting to hear from Pastor Strader. Pastor Strader was the only person kind enough to answer my Open Letters directly even though he must be exceedingly busy. (They have been busy changing venue locations, etc. in Lakeland.)
I would like to say to him personally that I sincerely appreciated his engaging me in this discussion.
In our e-mail exchanges Pastor Strader discusses the "angel" Emma, Todd Bentley's relationship to Bob Jones, Patricia King, etc. and his methods of "stewarding" this movement.
I am going to post the e-mails in order, and in their entirety and let Pastor Strader speak for himself.
Once again (as with both John Kilpatrick's and Dr. George O. Wood's statements regarding my letters) my questions were basically ignored, but you will se that the last things Pastor Strader wrote answer my questions pretty clearly. Please comment below.
The e-mails follow: My e-mails/responses are BLUE Pastor Strader's are RED
(NOTE: This is a LONG post containing 4 e-mails and 4 responses but WELL WORTH YOUR TIME.)
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Saturday, May 31, 2008
PASTOR STRADER SPEAKS: On Todd Bentley, Emma, Revival, etc.
Friday, May 30, 2008
LAKELAND HEALINGS: Are they real? ...does it matter?
We have been seeing a few other blogs receive comments that say (in effect) "You shouldn't/can't say this is not a move of God! Look at all the people who are being healed and saved!"
I will go ahead and deal with the salvation aspect now. I say "How can we KNOW if people are being saved or not? We can't know at this early stage because there has been no time to witness ongoing fruit from the "savees". So salvation is a non-issue in the argument of whether or not the Florida Outpouring" is a "move of God".
Concerning ALL of the healings (real, imagined and false), I thought I should post my response as an article. What I wrote contains what I feel about the miraculous healings at Lakeland and I have edited the content slightly.
Please read on.
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Firstly, this blog has not once said that the Lakeland healings are false, or that there have been no healings at Lakeland, and we are not concerned with disproving healings.
I'm quite sure there have been people healed at Lakeland, and I'm even more sure more people will come around saying they have been healed at Lakeland. So, Ok... I'm glad that this particular pastor was healed and I sincerely wish him the best.
Now that that's out of the way, I must say that nothing that the commenter said and nothing miraculous that's happened at Lakeland,
(including his pastor's healing), changes anything on this blog.
• Todd Bentley STILL teaches, believes in, and promotes unscriptural teachings.
• He still has heretical articles and videos available from his website.
• He still fails to preach a clear message of the Gospel of Jesus Christ as the bible commands.
• Depending on when you tune in, there is little to no sin, repentance and faith preached to bring people to a true conversion and new birth.
• He is still in fellowship with heretics, sexual deviants, false prophets, and false teachers
• He still refers to the same heretics, drunks, false prophets and false teachers as his spiritual heros.
• He still regularly twists scripture all over the place causing it to bend to the point he wants to make.
• And he himself is still a false prophet, a heretic and a blasphemer.
And on, and on....
Until the day that Todd Bentley himself stands in front of his camera and publicly repents from his previous errors and heresies and tells the world that he was wrong... AND until the day AFTER THAT when he preaches a clear consistent gospel message, leading people to Christ rather than to healing, I will continue to warn people about him and encourage them to stay AWAY from him and his revival.
Psychics all over the world can tell you "secret" things about yourself or others.
And shamans, witches, voodoo workers, pagans, wiccans, etc. have all had verified healings.
So how can we tell that the Florida Outpouring should be avoided? By the Word of God,... and it says to avoid false teachers! (Just do a little googling and looking around on Todd Bentley's site.)
Don't be deceived. Do you really think that a pastor's healing, people getting up out of wheelchairs, or even 16, 20, or 100 resurrections makes the Florida Revival a true move of God?
God is consistent. When the people respond to His Word bringing Him a sacrifice of humility, godly sorrow for sin, repentance of the heart, and a cry for mercy and forgiveness, God is moved and offers them life freely based of the death and resurrection of his Son, Jesus.
THAT is true revival. Just ask Jonathan Edwards, George Whitfield, the Wesleys, Spurgeon, etc. Miracles have been known to occur when people repent... but God doesn't want a healing revival! He wants a salvation revival!
A church service SHOULD BE ALL about Jesus...
A sermon SHOULD BE ALL about Jesus...
A "revival" especially SHOULD BE ALL about Jesus...
...NOT "a little" talk about Jesus to make a point or to give an air of authority to the speaker, and then "much more" talk about the healings going on. Every night at the Lakeland "Florida Outpouring" there is LITTLE about Jesus and a LOT about glory clouds, angels, healings, miracles, impartations, etc.
Saying "in the name of Jesus" and We love you Jesus" is NOT a gospel message. Jesus is NOT being preached at the Florida Outpouring... He is being "name-dropped".
Thursday, May 29, 2008
Enemies of the Cross of Christ
Philippians 3:17-20 says:
"For I have told you often before, and I say it again with tears in my eyes, that there are many whose conduct shows they are really enemies of the cross of Christ... Their future is eternal destruction. Their god is their appetite, they brag about shameful things, and all they think about is life here on earth."
In Philippians 3:3-6 Paul tells us to put no confidence in human effort, but instead to boast about what Christ has done for us. He goes on to say that if anyone had reason to boast it would be him. He was circumcised at eight days old, born to a pure-blood Jewish family, from the tribe of Benjamin. He was a member of the Pharisees, who were the...
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...strictest when it came to the Jewish law. He obeyed the law so carefully that he was never accused of any fault.
And yet verse 7 tells us that even though at one time he thought all this was very important, he now considers it worthless because of what Christ did.
I am sure there are things that you could boast about. Don't be shy. Like the time you gave extra offering, cleaned up the kitchen after fellowship on Sunday night, and no one even thanked you. What about that time your friend needed 20 bucks and you stepped right in there.
While these are all wonderful things, they are nothing compared to knowing Christ.
Have we come to the place where we say (like in verse 8 of chapter 3) all these things that I have done, are nothing when compared with the priceless gain of knowing Christ Jesus our Lord.
Have we discarded everything else, counting it all as garbage, so that we may trust and rest in Jesus Christ alone for salvation and righteousness and give Christ ALL of the glory for that righteousness, and become one with Him?
In Phil. 3:9 Paul says, "I no longer count on my own goodness or my ability to obey God's law, but I trust Christ to save me. For God's way of making us right with Himself depends on faith."
Your goodness is nothing, and you can never fully obey God's law. The Bible says in James 2:10 that if you stumble in one part of the law you are guilty of breaking the whole law.
Romans 4:13-16 "For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith. For if those who are of the law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise made of no effect, because the law brings about wrath; for where there is no law there is no transgression. Therefore it is of faith that it might be according to grace, so that the promise might be sure to all the seed, not only to those who are of the law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all"
So then it is not keeping the law that is the key, but faith is the key.
In verse 20-22, it tells us the kind of faith that Abraham had, and the result.
Romans 4:20-21 "He did not waver at the promise of God through unbelief, but was strengthened in faith, giving glory to God, and being fully convinced that what He had promised He was also able to perform. And therefore "it was accounted to him for righteousness.
Abraham never wavered in believing God's promise. In fact, his faith grew stronger, and in this he brought glory to God. He was ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED that God was able to do anything he promised."
Do you have unwavering faith in God?
Does your faith grow stronger when circumstances around you seem impossible to overcome.
Abraham believed God's promises about his descendants even though he was 100 yrs old, and his wife 90. He couldn't see a way around his obstacles, but he knew God would keep His word no matter what the situation appeared to be.
What has God promised us?
Romans 4:22-25 "And because of Abraham's faith, God declared him to be righteous. Now this wonderful truth-that God declared him to be righteous-wasn't just for Abraham's benefit. It was for us, too, assuring us that God will also declare us to be righteous if we believe in God, who brought Jesus our Lord back from the dead. He was handed over to die because of our sins, and He was raised from the dead to make us right with God."
He has promised us salvation through faith in Christ. Do you have faith in God to keep his promise?
Galatians 3:10-13 But Christ has rescued us from the curse pronounced by the law. When He was hung on the cross, He took upon Himself the curse for our wrong doing.
John 3:18 He that believeth on Him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Our salvation isn't a result of our Godly conduct, our good deeds, or our love of others.
But instead, our Godly conduct, our good deeds, and our love of others are a result of our faith in Christ.
John 13:34-35 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this all will know that you are My disciples, if you have love for one another.
Ephesians 4:25-32 Therefore, putting away lying, "Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor," for we are members of one another. "Be angry, and do not sin": do not let the sun go down on your wrath, nor give place to the devil. Let him who stole steal no longer, but rather let him labor, working with his hands what is good, that he may have something to give him who has need. Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification, that it may impart grace to the hearers. And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice. And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.
When Christ changes you into a new creature, you have His Spirit living in you. His desires become your desires. Your conduct becomes His.
So, does your conduct show that you are an enemy of the Cross of Christ, or that you are a friend of God?
There is nothing good in any of us to start with, we are all sinful creatures bound for an eternal separation from God. When we realize that we are nothing, and can do nothing for our spiritual state, then we can see that Christ is everything, and has done everything required to save us.
If you are trusting in your deeds for your righteousness, you are still an enemy of the cross.
If you are trusting in Christ alone for your salvation, your conduct will show it.
Romans 5:10-11 "For since we were restored to friendship with God by the death of His Son while we were still His enemies, we will certainly be delivered from eternal punishment by His life. So now we can rejoice in our wonderful new relationship with God-all because of what our Lord Jesus Christ has done for us in making us friends of God."
So with the question , "Are we enemies of the cross?", we should first consider if we have truly been made a friend of God..
In Christ
KDS
Tuesday, May 27, 2008
STEPHEN STRADER: My response to his lacking statement
Ignited Church (Assembly of God) Pastor Stephen Strader responded to my Open Letter. In his response Pastor Strader says they need our "Prayers and Encouragement"... I must assure him that they already have my (our?) prayers! And I heartily ENCOURAGE HIM and everyone else involved, to drop the garbage that they are "preaching" that falls outside the revealed Word of God...
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to preach instead a consistent, clear message of sin, repentance, and righteousness through Jesus Christ alone.
Pastor Strader said "as of TODAY -- Todd has said or done nothing that is in direct conflict with any A/G doctrine."
That is very much debatable, and the silence of any AG leader thus far concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine worries me greatly about the spiritual health of the denomination!
Pastor Strader continued... "He (Todd) has had "guests" on the platform that would not be acceptable (by AoG Standards), but "those guests" are just "guests" and Todd and myself are leading this as best we can."
Unfortunately, Todd's guests ARE Pastor Strader's guests. What does "leadership" mean if not keeping heretics off your stage? And if they are unacceptable to the AoG, Pastor Strader should be reprimanded by the NHQ for hosting these "unacceptable guests"!
Pastor Strader also said "Do you remember when the hurricane hit New Orleans? You had people DEMANDING to know "why" there were people in the super dome not being cared for... they wanted answers... that wasn't the time to ask "why"... it was TIME TO GET THEM HELP... We need HELP... not questions..."
My response is how many more souls would have died without the questions? Pastor Strader, NOW IS the time to ask biblical questions to help SAVE THE PEOPLE both from this mess now, and in future "winds" of false revival,... not "Wait and See" what is left standing and who is left alive after the storm blows over! People are being led to destruction by way of Todd's unbiblical "Winds of Change" mess.
Pastor Strader asked for prayer and I believe we should all oblige him. Pray for him. Pray for Todd Bentley. And pray (or continue to pray) for all involved and the thousands of people who are being led into deception by way of the "Florida Outpouring".
_________________________________________________________________________
PASTOR STRADER'S LETTER TO ME FOLLOWS:
Jon
I'm very sorry... I just don't have the time to answer all of your questions or concerns...
I guarantee that if you had three A/G pastors in a room, somebody would be in disagreement with something one of the other two is doing.
This is NOT about the A/G or Todd or me... this is a God thing... I don't "own it" nor can I "control it"
I think the mistakes of the A/G is that they "threw out the baby with the bath water" when they renounced the "latter rain" outpouring. I think they made "blanket statements" that condemned the whole bunch because of a few "bad apples"...
None of us wants to make that same mistake again.
The A/G made those statements "years" after the movement was started... today is only day 55... do you understand that WE don't even understand what is happening???
Todd and I have discussed many doctrinal "adjustments" that he has made over his ten years of ministry -- just like any man of God -- he is constantly adjusting...
as of TODAY -- Todd has said or done nothing that is in direct conflict with any A/G doctrine. He has had "guests" on the platform that would not be acceptable, but "those guests" are just "guests" and Todd and myself are leading this as best we can.
Have you ever watched Fox News have a "panel debate" over a "speech" given by the President??? Those speeches have been "thought out" worked on by specialists... lawyers... politicians... etc... EVERYTHING we are doing on that stage is PURE SPONTANEOUS... it's like trying to "ride a bull"...
There are been many mistakes... we make adjustments and get back on the bull the next day... PLEASE -- PRAY FOR US -- this is NOT the time to "dissect" this or "analyze this"... We need your prayers and encouragement.
Do you remember when the hurricane hit New Orleans? You had people DEMANDING to know "why" there were people in the super dome not being cared for... they wanted answers... that wasn't the time to ask "why"... it was TIME TO GET THEM HELP...
We need HELP... not questions...
Stephen Strader
pastor@ignitedchurch.com
www.ignitedchurch.com
"Wait and See" what fruit Todd Bentley bears? The "Gamaliel Approach"
This is a wonderful article from EndTimesPropheticWords addressing all (including Dr. George Wood and Pastor Stephen Strader) who would say "lets just wait and see what fruit Todd bears or what miracles are done at the Lakeland "Florida Outpouring".
The bottom line is this;
"Wait and See" is a foolish and unbiblical position to take!
The article follows:...
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‘The Gamaliel Approach’ has been quoted a lot about the Lakeland Outpouring, to justify not speaking out about or criticising or ‘judging’ this movement and the doctrine and spirits behind it. The approach has frequently been posted into comments on this site, and on other forum boards, claiming to be the voice of ‘wisdom’ and ‘reason’. Even Jack Hayford, who should know a lot better, recently quoted Gamaliel’s words as a basis for his approach to spiritual discernment.
Although I wrote how the Gamaliel Approach is not scriptural in an article about Jack Hayford’s statement on Lakeland here:, I am reposting the Gamaliel Approach as an individual post as it is brought up so often by so many people. It needs to be vigorously refuted because it just ain’t scriptural!
The Gamaliel Position - a scriptural position or not? eg: currently understood re Lakeland as - Leave Todd Bentley and his ministry and movement alone, do not assess it or criticise it or take action about it, and if it is not of God it will die out by itself in time and fail.
Let’s look at what scripture says within context about who Gamaliel was, what Gamaliel actually said, and what he actually meant when he said the now oft-quoted words. Let’s also look at what Gamaliel did after speaking these words.
“When they heard this, they were furious and wanted to put them (the apostles) to death. But a Pharisee named Gamaliel, a teacher of the law, who was honored by all the people, stood up in the Sanhedrin and ordered that the men be put outside for a little while. Then he addressed them: “Men of Israel, consider carefully what you intend to do to these men. Some time ago Theudas appeared, claiming to be somebody, and about four hundred men rallied to him. He was killed, all his followers were dispersed, and it all came to nothing. After him, Judas the Galilean appeared in the days of the census and led a band of people in revolt. He too was killed, and all his followers were scattered. Therefore, in the present case I advise you: Leave these men alone! Let them go! For if their purpose or activity is of human origin, it will fail. But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop these men; you will only find yourselves fighting against God. ” (Acts 5:33-39)
Firstly, and most importantly, we see that Gamaliel was not a Christian, he was a zealous Jew opposed to Christianity on the persecutor’s side. Though he may well have trained Saul/Paul, remember Saul/Paul zealously killed Christians before he converted and later on looked back and considered himself an evil man and an enemy of God! Gamaliel may have taught Saul/Paul the law BUT it was Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit that showed Paul the truth and opened his eyes to it, not Gamaliel. The law brought death, and the Spirit brought life. Gamaliel was not inspired by the Holy Spirit and a friend of God, but Paul later was. So to quote and promote Gamaliel’s words, is to quote a zealous religiously blind persecutor and enemy of God, not an enlightened friend to the truth.
There is no evidence that what Gamaliel said was either scripturally sound or inspired by the Holy Spirit. Though his words are recorded in scripture, this does not mean them to be either right, wise or godly. God used what Gamaliel said to rescue the apostles from death, certainly, but it does not mean that his speech is therefore applicable and useful in any other contexts - especially when assessing Lakeland.
What Gamaliel said is not even true in a wider context, for if we examine religious or political movements through history, we find many not of God have prospered from the world’s perspective, as has evil in general prospered. Look at the Roman Catholic church! Look at the Mormon Church! Look at the Moonies! Look at Scientology! The list goes on and on and on by human perspective. Indeed, even Gamaliel’s movement that was opposed to God lived on and persecuted and killed many of the saints! So Gamaliel’s words, as well as coming from an enemy of God and not being scriptural, are not logical or true in the context Lakeland supporters apply them.
Then go to the next verse, verse 40. ‘His speech persuaded them. They called the apostles in and had them flogged. Then they ordered them not to speak in the name of Jesus, and let them go.’
Gamaliel had the apostles flogged and ordered the apostles not to speak in the name of Jesus. This is the verse Jack Hayford and others conveniently ignore, for if Gamaliel was moved by the Spirit of God and was wise and prophetic, then we have to say the following action was right to! But it was clearly not right or godly - it was the actions of a religious persecutor who did not know the truth, and sought rather to suppress and silence it. So Gamaliel’s words come from an enemy of God who persecutes and silences the truth and the followers of the truth, and the words are not scriptural, not prophetic, not logical and not true.
It is also clear to me that Gamaliel did not think the apostles to be of God, or that he could be fighting against God by opposing them - nor did he even harbour any doubts as to the possibility this was so - because of the other people and failed rebellions and uprisings he compared them to, and also what happened subsequently with him having them flogged and silenced. He was using a form of logic to make a point, he was not really saying ‘IF these men are of God’, as for him there was no IF.
So again, Gamaliel had made up his mind about the apostles and their way - he was not in any doubt as to it. If he was in any doubt and was ‘waiting and seeing’ their fruit, he would not have dared to publicly flog or silence them. So Gamaliel’s words come from an enemy of God and persecutor, his words are not scriptural, not logical, not prophetic and not true, they come from someone who had already made up his mind as to the spiritual identity and the truth of the men he ‘judged’, and his words are currently used out of context as they’re not applicable for a situation where there is the possibility of any doubt on this matter!
To use Gamaliel’s expression then so completely out of context is theologically illiterate and unjustifiable as well as illogical. It cannot rightly be applied to Lakeland by any stretch of the imagination.
Next, we need to realize that Gamaliel when talking about leaving the apostles ‘alone’, was speaking in the context of not having them killed. He was not talking about not speaking up about these men or judging or weighing up their theology as he had already done that. Because he had ‘judged them’, he took action by ordering them to be quiet about Jesus and punished them!
So if we truly take Gamaliel’s approach, we order Todd Bentley to be silent and publicly flog him for heresy! But I do not think Jack Hayford or any Todd Bentley supporters mean that - but they should -- if they use Gamaliel as an example to uphold and a role model.
So Gamaliel’s words come from an enemy of God and persecutor, his words are not scriptural, not logical, not prophetic and not true, they are not applicable for a situation where there is any doubt, and if we follow them to the letter we should actually take action, speak up and silence and punish the false prophets and teachers (albeit not kill them). Gamaliel took action (albeit he discerned and judged wrongly), he did NOT sit on the fence to wait and see!
The Bible makes it abundantly clear that the church should not take a laissez-faire leave alone approach to false doctrine or false apostles or false prophets. It says that the church should vigorously work to keep from false doctrine and false spirits and false apostles infecting it by testing and weighing and judging as previously discussed. It should be on guard and its watchmen and shepherds must do their job and ensure stuff does not creep in unawares. When bad stuff is found within, it must be dealt with and ‘judged’ ruthlessly. When false servants are found, or unrepentant sincere heretics, we are ordered not to associate with such men or allow them to get to the flock.
The Gamaliel ‘wait and see’ ’sit on the fence’ approach is sadly not biblical, and it is partly thanks to shepherds and followers that quote this that the church is in such an apostate state as it is today. By the time the church at large wakes up, if ever, to Todd Bentley and his schemes and resounds the warnings, well it will be too late for many as the damage will be done. The biblical attitude to discernment is not of Gamaliel - either in its true or distorted form.
JUST IN: Dr. George O. Wood's Official Statement concerning Lakeland
I just received a response to my Open Letter from Assemblies of God General Superintendent Dr. George O. Wood. Unfortunately, like Pastor Kilpatrick District Superintendent Terry Raburn, and Pastor Strader before him, he has provided NO ANSWERS to the pertinent questions, and has instead decided to leave the Assemblies of God people to themselves and their lovely golden calf without coming down off of his "mountain" to give them God's Word on the subject!
God has ALREADY hand-written the answers to the Lakeland question...
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...in stone. And the Assemblies of God is actually carrying it around the desert yet refusing to follow God's Word commanding them to ignore the false prophets. Yet Dr. Wood would prefer to "wait and see" if those who have crafted some glittery strange God and placed it in front of millions of God's people is "not of God"!
Why would he decide not to lead his people? Is he deceived himself? Or is he just "too busy" to concern himself with a worldwide "move of God"?
I guess we can just forget about upper-level concern and guidance in this matter.
I guess we can assume they have just dumped the wisdom and guidance of those godly men and women before them and have decided that the General Council statements of 1949 and 2000 condemning Todd Bentley's doctrines and teachings were worthless.
I guess we can assume that in 8 short years, the organization has degenerated to a "point of no return" to the Official Positions they once held!
The head of the Assemblies of God organization, the head of the Florida District, and the Pastor of the host-church all say "wait and see" without concern regarding the Word of God or the souls involved.
While the local AoG pastors and individual members decide to chase after the false-teaching "spirit of revival" in Lakeland, Florida, I pray that they can find the Scriptures through the sewage piled on top of it.
If no one in the organization will rise up and "judge those inside the church" to be idolotors and swindlers, it will be up to people like us, outside the organization, to continue to forward information about Mr. Bentley to our Assembly of God friends an continue to post the Truth and PRAY that some of the lowly AG church members (who might stand for God's Word) will find it.
So to every Assembly of God pastor, leader, teacher, or member who decides to refuse to bow down and worship the popular calf, PLEASE contact Dr. George Wood and voice your concerns NOW. And for those who would prefer to remain anonymous and yet voice your concerns, e-mail me and I will forward your message anonymously directly to Dr. Wood.
I look forward to your comments.
Dr. Wood's letter follows:
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Thank you for your email. I have been in Korea and Portugal the past two weeks – in Korea for the retirement of Dr. Cho and the 50th anniversary of his church; and in Portugal for the World Assemblies of God Congress. I have not been following events in Lakeland.
Historically, the General Council has always been slow to respond to comments about particular revivals or personalities. We tend very much to trust the discernment and maturity of our Assemblies of God people.
There are elements in any revival that invite criticism – certainly the Azusa St. Revival itself was not immune from excesses. However, with the judgment of time, we now see how effective that revival was.
Other revivals turned out only to be so-called revivals – and they left nothing fruitful in their wake.
When and if it seems appropriate for my office to release a statement regarding what is happening in Lakeland, I will do it first through communicating directly with the pastor of the church.
My lack of a statement on this matter at this moment should not be interpreted as a lack of concern; but more of a desire to not make a hasty or premature judgment. We are told in Scripture to test all things and hold fast that which is good, and we will endeavor to do that.
Blessings to you!George Wood
Monday, May 26, 2008
Are you hungry & thirsty for more of God?....Why?
The Israelites were thirsty...
Exodus 17:3-7
But the people were thirsty for water there, and they grumbled against Moses. They said, "Why did you bring us up out of Egypt to make us and our children and livestock die of thirst?" Then Moses cried out to the LORD, "What am I to do with these people? They are almost ready to stone me." The LORD answered Moses, "Walk on ahead of the people. Take with you some of the elders of Israel and take in your hand the staff with which you struck the Nile, and go. I will stand there before you by the rock at Horeb. Strike the rock, and water will come out of it for the people to drink." So Moses did this in the sight of the elders of Israel. And he called the place Massah and Meribah because the Israelites quarreled and because they tested the LORD saying, "Is the LORD among us or not?"
Their thirst was a spiritual thirst for Christ...
I Corinthians 10:1-4
For I do not want you to be ignorant of the fact,....
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...brothers, that our forefathers were all under the cloud and that they all passed through the sea. They were all baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea. They all ate the same spiritual food and drank the same spiritual drink; for they drank from the spiritual rock that accompanied them, and that rock was Christ.
The Israelites were hungry...
Exodus 16:2-4
In the desert the whole community grumbled against Moses and Aaron. The Israelites said to them, "If only we had died by the LORD's hand in Egypt! There we sat around pots of meat and ate all the food we wanted, but you have brought us out into this desert to starve this entire assembly to death." Then the LORD said to Moses, "I will rain down bread from heaven for you. The people are to go out each day and gather enough for that day. In this way I will test them and see whether they will follow my instructions.
Their hunger was a spiritual hunger for Christ...
John 6:32-40
Then Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, Moses did not give you the bread from heaven, but My Father gives you the true bread from heaven. For the bread of God is He who comes down from heaven and gives life to the world." Then they said to Him, "Lord, give us this bread always."
And Jesus said to them, "I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst. But I said to you that you have seen Me and yet do not believe. All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will by no means cast out.
For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. This is the will of the Father who sent Me, that of all He has given Me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up at the last day. And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that everyone who sees the Son and believes in Him may have everlasting life; and I will raise him up at the last day."
Luke 6:21
Blessed are you who HUNGER now, For you SHALL BE FILLED. Blessed are you who weep now, For you shall laugh.
This was BEFORE Jesus died and rose again. He knew what was ahead.
John 7:37-39
On the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried out, saying, "If anyone thirsts, let him come to Me and drink. He who believes in Me, as the Scripture has said, out of his heart will flow rivers of living water." But this He spoke concerning the Spirit, whom those believing in Him would receive; for the Holy Spirit was not yet given, because Jesus was not yet glorified.
Are you "thirsty for more of God"?
John 4:10-14
Jesus answered and said to her, "If you knew the gift of God, and who it is who says to you, ‘Give Me a drink,’ you would have asked Him, and He would have given you living water." The woman said to Him, "Sir, You have nothing to draw with, and the well is deep. Where then do You get that living water?
Are You greater than our father Jacob, who gave us the well, and drank from it himself, as well as his sons and his livestock?" Jesus answered and said to her, "Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will NEVER THIRST. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into everlasting life."
John 6:53-58
Then Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed.
He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him. As the living Father sent Me, and I live because of the Father, so he who feeds on Me will live because of Me. This is the bread which came down from heaven—not as your fathers ate the manna, and are dead. He who eats this bread WILL LIVE FOREVER."
Do we NEED MORE than what Christ has already given us?
Joh 3:27-29 ...John replied, "A man can receive only what is given him from heaven. You yourselves can testify that I said, 'I am not the Christ but am sent ahead of him.' The bride belongs to the bridegroom. The friend who attends the bridegroom waits and listens for him, and is full of joy when he hears the bridegroom's voice. That joy is mine, and it is now COMPLETE.
Colossians 2:8-10
Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ. For in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily; and you are COMPLETE IN HIM, who is the head of all principality and power.
Romans 5:17-19
For if by the one man’s offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.) Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life.
For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.
Romans 6:20-23
For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. What fruit did you have then in the things of which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death. But now having been set free from sin, and having become slaves of God, you have your fruit to holiness, and the end, everlasting life. For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord
Matthew 5:6
Blessed are those who HUNGER and THIRST for righteousness, For they shall be FILLED.
Romans 8:10-11
And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
II Peter 1:1-4
Simon Peter, a bondservant and apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who HAVE OBTAINED like precious faith with us by the righteousness of our God and Savior Jesus Christ: Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, as His divine power has given to us ALL things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.
I John 5:9-13
If we receive the witness of men, the witness of God is greater; for this is the witness of God which He has testified of His Son. He who believes in the Son of God has the witness in himself; he who does not believe God has made Him a liar, because he has not believed the testimony that God has given of His Son.
And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life,and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.
John 14:15-18
If you love Me, keep My commandments. And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may abide with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
Matthew 28:18-20
And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Amen.
Romans 8:21-4
Therefore, there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus, because through Christ Jesus the law of the Spirit of life set me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man,in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met (to finish, accomplish, satisfy)in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit.
Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ, for it is the power of God to salvation for everyone who believes, for the Jew first and also for the Greek.
God HAS ALREADY GIVEN us eternal life, the power of God through the gospel of Christ, freedom from sin and death, righteousness through Christ, His mercy, peace, joy, grace, the Spirit of Truth that dwells with us forever, all things that pertain to life and Godliness,and He gave us HIS ONLY SON JESUS CHRIST
When you ask for more of something, you are saying that what was given to you is not good enough, and that it did not satisfy you.
What "more" do you want?
What MORE do you really NEED.
In Christ,
KDS
JUST IN: Stephen Strader's Official Statement Concerning Lakeland
Ignited Church (Assembly of God) Pastor Stephen Strader has just responded to my Open Letter.
I am unable at the moment to post my commentary on Pastor Strader's response to my letter but it will be coming shortly. Until then, feel free to comment with your thoughts. And subscribe by e-mail or feed to make sure you get updates on this important issue. Pastor Strader asked for prayer and I believe we should all oblige him. Pray for him. Pray for Todd Bentley. And pray or continue to pray for all involved and the thousands of people who are being led into deception by way of the "Florida Outpouring".
Below is Pastor Strader's Official Response. Following his reponse is the letter I sent him.
Jon
I'm very sorry... I just don't have the time to answer all of your questions or concerns...
I guarantee that if you had three A/G pastors in a room, somebody would be in disagreement with something one of the other two is doing.
This is NOT about the A/G or Todd or me... this is a God thing... I don't "own it" nor can I "control it"
I think the mistakes of the A/G is that...
[+-] Expand/Collapse Post
...they "threw out the baby with the bath water" when they renounced the "latter rain" outpouring. I think they made "blanket statements" that condemned the whole bunch because of a few "bad apples"...
None of us wants to make that same mistake again.
The A/G made those statements "years" after the movement was started... today is only day 55... do you understand that WE don't even understand what is happening???
Todd and I have discussed many doctrinal "adjustments" that he has made over his ten years of ministry -- just like any man of God -- he is constantly adjusting...
as of TODAY -- Todd has said or done nothing that is in direct conflict with any A/G doctrine. He has had "guests" on the platform that would not be acceptable, but "those guests" are just "guests" and Todd and myself are leading this as best we can.
Have you ever watched Fox News have a "panel debate" over a "speech" given by the President??? Those speeches have been "thought out" worked on by specialists... lawyers... politicians... etc... EVERYTHING we are doing on that stage is PURE SPONTANEOUS... it's like trying to "ride a bull"...
There are been many mistakes... we make adjustments and get back on the bull the next day... PLEASE -- PRAY FOR US -- this is NOT the time to "dissect" this or "analyze this"... We need your prayers and encouragement.
Do you remember when the hurricane hit New Orleans? You had people DEMANDING to know "why" there were people in the super dome not being cared for... they wanted answers... that wasn't the time to ask "why"... it was TIME TO GET THEM HELP...
We need HELP... not questions...
Stephen Strader
pastor@ignitedchurch.com
www.ignitedchurch.com
__________________________________________________________________________
__________________________________________________________________________
__________________________________________________________________________
__________________________________________________________________________
BELOW IS THE LETTER PASTOR STRADER IS RESPONDING TO ABOVE.
Pastor Stephen Strader,
I am in the process of determining the Assemblies of God current position concerning previous Official Statements and their official view of Todd Bentley. Out of 5 letters I have sent (to Dr. George Wood, Terry Raburn, Steve Hill, John Kilpatrick and AG Public Relations Director Keith Surface) I have only received a response from Pastor John Kilpatrick. But I am not satisfied with his statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) John Kilpatrick, at least, was "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement in response to my e-mail about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
My concern is, how could Pastor Kilpatrick, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe he does) do something like stand in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring" as a man and move of God?
Also, how can you, in maintaining an Assemblies of God church, host, sponsor, and support Todd Bentley and his unbiblical (as the Assemblies of God have previously declared) ministry?
In the end there are only three options I can see why Pastors John Kilpatrick and Steve Hill and yourself might stand in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) You (they) are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) You (they) do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as you (they) should (and which Pastor Kilpatrick's response says he does). At least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance of hosting, sponsoring, supporting and appearing on stage with him.
(3) You (they) were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to host Todd Bentley and to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe Pastor Kilpatrick when he says that he holds doctrine in high regard, but I can't when he was thoughtless enough to put himself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
I have also heard you spend a great deal of time on television and internet video defending Todd Bentley and this revival as a move of God. The only problem is that you can't defend that position by scripture.
Pastor Kilpatrick said in his statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations for quite some time and they should have alarmed all of you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like Pastor Kilpatrick is attempting to say that he knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why he, yourself, Pastor Steve Hill, Terry Raburn, and Dr. George Wood should now "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches and say:
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Resolution 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And I, Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick were wrong to go on his stage, support him, promote him and host him."
And it is time NOW for the Assemblies of God to pull themselves OUT of this unbiblical movement that is claiming to be "of God" yet is mixed and mingled with heresies and heretics, false prophecies and false prophets, false teachings and false teachers, and worst of all, a leader who (by his own words) makes Jesus Christ of less concern than the "the supernatural"... and He says God told him to do it!
Or maybe you, Pastor Strader are a full Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter. If so, I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical. Then the many who still hold dearly the Holy Word of God and the past godly resolutions of the Assemblies of God can have a final word. Until you make a statement, tens of thousands of your members are confused. This revival DOES NOT line up with scripture, its leader DOES NOT line up with scripture, his mentors, BOB JONES, JACK COE, WILLIAM BRANHAM, A.A. ALLEN etc. etc., who DO NOT line up with scripture, and, some of which, the Assemblies of God have in the past refused to associate with, or the Assemblies of God have taken away AG credentials from.
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley, because he is basically saying "What the AG formerly said is false. These are men of God! These are moves of God! These are the words of God!" etc, etc,
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley so they can decide whether they will go along with the NEW Assemblies of God, or continue to agree with the OLD Assemblies of God and deem it unbiblical, and get out.
I only have two questions and I would like you to answer them in response to this e-mail...
1. Do you, Stephen Strader agree with and stand behind the official statements of the Assemblies of God General Councils of 1949 and in Resolution 16 at General Council 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which both condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Stephen Strader, officially consider Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) as straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] I believe Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry are BIBLICAL
[ ] I believe Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry are IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
P.S. This letter and any response I receive from you will be posted at my blog site.
Also archived are the previous articles and letters I have written.
TODD BENTLEY: God said "Kick that woman in the face"?
All I can say is wow. I guess the violent really DO take it by force!
Open Letters: No real answers from the Assemblies of God.
UPDATE: Though I received a response from Dr. George Wood, John Kilpatrick, and Stephen Strader, I received No answers to my questions. (I must, however, thank Pastor Stephen Strader for his more detailed responses.) I will begin a more generalized campaign contacting individual pastors and churches with information concerning the contradictions between the AoG responses to the Latter Rain Movement in 1949, the General Council Resolution 16, in 2000 and this "third wave" return to Latter Rain teachings. The Assemblies of God has failed to observe and heed the voices of their past leaders.
Below are all of the letters as I sent them to the Assemblies of God leaders including:
•General Superintendent, Dr. George Wood: gwood@ag.org
•Peninsular FL Dist. Supt, Terry Raburn: traburn@penflorida.org
•AG Public Relations Director, Keith Surface: ksurface@ag.org
•Steve Hill's church: contact@stevehill.org
•John Kilpatrick's church: ministry@johnkilpatrick.org
•Stephen Strader's church:karlajoy@aol.com via church secretary Karla Dickson
I posted them here for three reasons...
(1) Because I said that I would.
(2) Because they all vary slightly based on who it was sent to.
(3) So others could begin to ask the same questions to their pastors and leaders.
If you are concerned about the future and direction of the Assemblies of God and their involvement with this false revival, I suggest you e-mail the above leaders as well.
I told each recipient (except John Kilpatrick) the following:
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
So here they are in the above order. WARNING: This is a LONG post since it contains multiple letters. CLICK BELOW TO VIEW THEM.
[+-] Expand/Collapse Post
___________________________________________________________________________
Dr. George O. Wood,
Out of 5 letters I have sent I have only received a response from Pastor John Kilpatrick. But I am not satisfied with his statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) John Kilpatrick, at least, was "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement in response to my e-mail about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
How could Pastor Kilpatrick, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe he does) be "duped" to do something like that?
In the end there are only three options I can see why Pastors Kilpatrick and Hill might have stood in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) They are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) They do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as they should (and Pastor Kilpatrick's response says he does). At least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance of appearing on stage with him.
(3) They were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe Pastor Kilpatrick when he says that he holds doctrine in high regard, but I can't when he was thoughtless enough to put himself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
Pastor Kilpatrick said in his statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations for quite some time and they should have alarmed all of you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like Pastor Kilpatrick is attempting to say that he knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why he (and you Dr. Wood) should now "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches and say:
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Resolution 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And I was wrong to go on his stage."
And it is time NOW for the Assemblies of God to pull themselves OUT of this movement that is claiming to be "of God" yet is mixed and mingled with heresies and heretics, false prophecies and false prophets, false teachings and false teachers, and worst of all, a leader who (by his own words) makes Jesus Christ of less concern than the "the supernatural"... and He says God told him to do it!
Or maybe you are all actually a Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter and are happy with Pastor Kilpatrick's detail-lacking "Official Statement". If so, I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical. Then the many who still hold dearly the Holy Word of God and the past godly resolutions of the Assemblies of God can have a final word. Until you make a statement, tens of thousands of your members are confused. This revival DOES NOT line up with scripture, its leader DOES NOT line up with scripture, his mentors, BOB JONES, JACK COE, WILLIAM BRANHAM, A.A. ALLEN etc. etc., who DO NOT line up with scripture, and, some of which, the Assemblies of God have in the past refused to associate with, or the Assemblies of God have taken away AG credentials from.
Your congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley, because he is basically saying "What the AG formerly said is false. These are men of God! These are moves of God! These are the words of God!" etc, etc,
Your congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley so they can decide whether they will go along with the NEW Assemblies of God, or continue to agree with the OLD Assemblies of God and deem it unbiblical, and get out.
I only have two questions and I would like you to answer them in response to this e-mail...
1. Do you, Dr. George O. Wood, agree or disagree with the official stance and statements of the Assemblies of God as discussed at General Council in 1949 and in Resolution 16 at General Council 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which both condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Dr. George O. Wood, believe that Todd Bentley's doctrine and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) is straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS BIBLICAL
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
P.S. This letter and any response I receive from you will be posted at my blog site.
Also archived are the previous articles and letters I have written.
__________________________________________________________________
Superintendent Terry Raburn,
Out of 5 letters I have sent I have only received a response from Pastor John Kilpatrick. But I am not satisfied with his statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) John Kilpatrick, at least, was "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement in response to my e-mail about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
How could Pastor Kilpatrick, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe he does) be "duped" to do something like that?
In the end there are only three options I can see why Pastors Kilpatrick and Hill might have stood in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) They are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) They do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as they should (and Pastor Kilpatrick's response says he does). At least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance of appearing on stage with him.
(3) They were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe Pastor Kilpatrick when he says that he holds doctrine in high regard, but I can't when he was thoughtless enough to put himself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
Pastor Kilpatrick said in his statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations for quite some time and they should have alarmed all of you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like Pastor Kilpatrick is attempting to say that he knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why he (and you Bro. Raburn) should now "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches and say:
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Resolution 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick were wrong to go on his stage."
And it is time NOW for the Assemblies of God to pull themselves OUT of this movement that is claiming to be "of God" yet is mixed and mingled with heresies and heretics, false prophecies and false prophets, false teachings and false teachers, and worst of all, a leader who (by his own words) makes Jesus Christ of less concern than the "the supernatural"... and He says God told him to do it!
Or maybe you are all actually a Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter and are happy with Pastor Kilpatrick's detail-lacking "Official Statement". If so, I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical. Then the many who still hold dearly the Holy Word of God and the past godly resolutions of the Assemblies of God can have a final word. Until you make a statement, tens of thousands of your members are confused. This revival DOES NOT line up with scripture, its leader DOES NOT line up with scripture, his mentors, BOB JONES, JACK COE, WILLIAM BRANHAM, A.A. ALLEN etc. etc., who DO NOT line up with scripture, and, some of which, the Assemblies of God have in the past refused to associate with, or the Assemblies of God have taken away AG credentials from.
Your congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley, because he is basically saying "What the AG formerly said is false. These are men of God! These are moves of God! These are the words of God!" etc, etc,
Your congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley so they can decide whether they will go along with the NEW Assemblies of God, or continue to agree with the OLD Assemblies of God and deem it unbiblical, and get out.
I only have two questions and I would like you to answer them in response to this e-mail...
1. Do you, Terry Raburn, agree or disagree with the official stance and statements of the Assemblies of God as discussed at General Council in 1949 and in Resolution 16 at General Council 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which both condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Terry Raburn, believe that Todd Bentley's doctrine and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) is straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS BIBLICAL
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
P.S. This letter and any response I receive from you will be posted at my blog site.
Also archived are the previous articles and letters I have written.
___________________________________________________________________
Public Relations Director, Keith Surface,
Since your position is simply Public Relations Director, I will not address your personal convictions. But I will ask you the stance of the Assemblies of God.
Out of 5 letters I have sent I have only received a response from Pastor John Kilpatrick. But I am not satisfied with his statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) John Kilpatrick, at least, was "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement in response to my e-mail about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
How could Pastor Kilpatrick, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe he does) be "duped" to do something like that?
In the end there are only three options I can see why Pastors Kilpatrick and Hill might have stood in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) They are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) They do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as they should (and Pastor Kilpatrick's response says he does). At least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance of appearing on stage with him.
(3) They were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe Pastor Kilpatrick when he says that he holds doctrine in high regard, but I can't when he was thoughtless enough to put himself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
Pastor Kilpatrick said in his statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations for quite some time and they should have alarmed all of you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like Pastor Kilpatrick is attempting to say that he knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why he, Pastor Steve Hill, Terry Raburn, and Dr. George Wood should now "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches and say:
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Resolution 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick were wrong to go on his stage."
And it is time NOW for the Assemblies of God to pull themselves OUT of this movement that is claiming to be "of God" yet is mixed and mingled with heresies and heretics, false prophecies and false prophets, false teachings and false teachers, and worst of all, a leader who (by his own words) makes Jesus Christ of less concern than the "the supernatural"... and He says God told him to do it!
Or maybe they are all actually Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporters and are happy with Pastor Kilpatrick's detail-lacking "Official Statement". If so, I believe they should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical. Then the many who still hold dearly the Holy Word of God and the past godly resolutions of the Assemblies of God can have a final word. Until you make a statement, tens of thousands of your members are confused. This revival DOES NOT line up with scripture, its leader DOES NOT line up with scripture, his mentors, BOB JONES, JACK COE, WILLIAM BRANHAM, A.A. ALLEN etc. etc., who DO NOT line up with scripture, and, some of which, the Assemblies of God have in the past refused to associate with, or the Assemblies of God have taken away AG credentials from.
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley, because he is basically saying "What the AG formerly said is false. These are men of God! These are moves of God! These are the words of God!" etc, etc,
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley so they can decide whether they will go along with the NEW Assemblies of God, or continue to agree with the OLD Assemblies of God and deem it unbiblical, and get out.
I only have two questions and I would like you to answer them in response to this e-mail...
1. Do the Assemblies of God still stand behind the official statements of the Assemblies of God General Councils of 1949 and in Resolution 16 at General Council 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which both condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] The Assemblies of God STILL STANDS BEHIND the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] The Assemblies of God REFUSES TO STAND BEHIND the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do the Assemblies of God officially consider Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) as straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS OFFICIALLY CONSIDERED BIBLICAL
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS OFFICIALLY CONSIDERED UNBIBLICAL
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
P.S. This letter and any response I receive from you will be posted at my blog site.
Also archived are the previous articles and letters I have written.
______________________________________________________________________
Pastor Steve Hill,
Out of 5 letters I have sent I have only received a response from Pastor John Kilpatrick. But I am not satisfied with his statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) John Kilpatrick, at least, was "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement in response to my e-mail about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
How could Pastor Kilpatrick, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe he does) be "duped" to do something like that?
In the end there are only three options I can see why Pastors Kilpatrick and Hill might have stood in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) They are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) They do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as they should (and Pastor Kilpatrick's response says he does). At least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance of appearing on stage with him.
(3) They were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe Pastor Kilpatrick when he says that he holds doctrine in high regard, but I can't when he was thoughtless enough to put himself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
Pastor Kilpatrick said in his statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations for quite some time and they should have alarmed all of you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like Pastor Kilpatrick is attempting to say that he knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why he (and you Pastor Hill) should now "fess up" (especially to their own congregations and the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches) and say
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Resolution 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And I was wrong to go on his stage."
And it is time NOW for the Assemblies of God to pull themselves OUT of this movement that is claiming to be "of God" yet is mixed and mingled with heresies and heretics, false prophecies and false prophets, false teachings and false teachers, and worst of all, a leader who (by his own words) makes Jesus Christ of less concern than the "the supernatural"... and He says God told him to do it!
Or maybe you are all actually a Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter and are happy with Pastor Kilpatrick's detail-lacking "Official Statement". If so, I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical. Then the many who still hold dearly the Holy Word of God and the past godly resolutions of the Assemblies of God can have a final word. Until you make a statement, tens of thousands of your members are confused. This revival DOES NOT line up with scripture, its leader DOES NOT line up with scripture, his mentors, BOB JONES, JACK COE, WILLIAM BRANHAM, A.A. ALLEN etc. etc., who DO NOT line up with scripture, and, some of which, the Assemblies of God have in the past refused to associate with, or the Assemblies of God have taken away AG credentials from.
Your congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley, because he is basically saying "What the AG formerly said is false. These are men of God! These are moves of God! These are the words of God!" etc, etc,
Your congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley so they can decide whether they will go along with the NEW Assemblies of God, or continue to agree with the OLD Assemblies of God and deem it unbiblical, and get out.
I only have two questions and I would like you to answer them in response to this e-mail...
1. Do you, Pastor Steve Hill, agree or disagree with the official stance and statements of the Assemblies of God as discussed at General Council in 1949 and in Resolution 16 at General Council 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which both condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Pastor Steve Hill, believe that Todd Bentley's doctrine and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) is straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS BIBLICAL
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
P.S. This letter and any response I receive from you will be posted at my blog site.
Also archived are the previous articles and letters I have written.
___________________________________________________________________
To Pastor John Kilpatrick:
Sir,
I sincerely appreciate you responding with a statement to my previous e-mail. Yours is the only response I have received of the 5 letters I have sent. But I am not satisfied with your statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, and/or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) you were "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
How could you, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe you do) be "duped" to do something like that?
Perhaps someone told you they were taking you to speak at the Assemblies of General Council but then took you to Florida instead?
(I'm very serious... If you were "duped" in any way I'd love to hear the story from you!)
In the end there are only three options I can see why you might have stood in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) You are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) You do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as your statement says you do. (at least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance)
(3) You were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe you Pastor Kilpatrick when you say that you hold doctrine in high regard, but I can't when you were thoughtless enough to put yourself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
You said in your statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations and they should have alarmed you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like you are attempting to say that you knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why you should now "fess up" (especially to your own congregation and the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches) and say
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Article 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And I was wrong to go on his stage."
Or maybe you are actually a Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter and are happy with your detail-lacking "Official Statement". If so I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world.
My two questions?...
1. Do you, Pastor John Kilpatrick, agree or disagree with the official stance and statements of the Assemblies of God as discussed at General Council in 1949 and 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Pastor John Kilpatrick, believe that Todd Bentley's doctrine and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) is straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS BIBLICAL
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you, Steve Hill, Stephen Strader, and Dr. George O. Wood if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
The only problem is that any answers you may give will have some consequences of strong criticism. I hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
God bless you.
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
I am also sending these questions to Steve Hill, Stephen Strader, and Dr. George O. Wood
____________________________________________________________________________
Pastor Stephen Strader,
I am in the process of determining the Assemblies of God current position concerning previous Official Statements and their official view of Todd Bentley. Out of 5 letters I have sent (to Dr. George Wood, Terry Raburn, Steve Hill, John Kilpatrick and AG Public Relations Director Keith Surface) I have only received a response from Pastor John Kilpatrick. But I am not satisfied with his statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) John Kilpatrick, at least, was "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement in response to my e-mail about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
My concern is, how could Pastor Kilpatrick, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe he does) do something like stand in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring" as a man and move of God?
Also, how can you, in maintaining an Assemblies of God church, host, sponsor, and support Todd Bentley and his unbiblical (as the Assemblies of God have previously declared) ministry?
In the end there are only three options I can see why Pastors John Kilpatrick and Steve Hill and yourself might stand in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) You (they) are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) You (they) do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as you (they) should (and which Pastor Kilpatrick's response says he does). At least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance of hosting, sponsoring, supporting and appearing on stage with him.
(3) You (they) were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to host Todd Bentley and to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe Pastor Kilpatrick when he says that he holds doctrine in high regard, but I can't when he was thoughtless enough to put himself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
I have also heard you spend a great deal of time on television and internet video defending Todd Bentley and this revival as a move of God. The only problem is that you can't defend that position by scripture.
Pastor Kilpatrick said in his statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations for quite some time and they should have alarmed all of you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like Pastor Kilpatrick is attempting to say that he knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why he, yourself, Pastor Steve Hill, Terry Raburn, and Dr. George Wood should now "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches and say:
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Resolution 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And I, Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick were wrong to go on his stage, support him, promote him and host him."
And it is time NOW for the Assemblies of God to pull themselves OUT of this unbiblical movement that is claiming to be "of God" yet is mixed and mingled with heresies and heretics, false prophecies and false prophets, false teachings and false teachers, and worst of all, a leader who (by his own words) makes Jesus Christ of less concern than the "the supernatural"... and He says God told him to do it!
Or maybe you, Pastor Strader are a full Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter. If so, I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical. Then the many who still hold dearly the Holy Word of God and the past godly resolutions of the Assemblies of God can have a final word. Until you make a statement, tens of thousands of your members are confused. This revival DOES NOT line up with scripture, its leader DOES NOT line up with scripture, his mentors, BOB JONES, JACK COE, WILLIAM BRANHAM, A.A. ALLEN etc. etc., who DO NOT line up with scripture, and, some of which, the Assemblies of God have in the past refused to associate with, or the Assemblies of God have taken away AG credentials from.
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley, because he is basically saying "What the AG formerly said is false. These are men of God! These are moves of God! These are the words of God!" etc, etc,
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley so they can decide whether they will go along with the NEW Assemblies of God, or continue to agree with the OLD Assemblies of God and deem it unbiblical, and get out.
I only have two questions and I would like you to answer them in response to this e-mail...
1. Do you, Stephen Strader agree with and stand behind the official statements of the Assemblies of God General Councils of 1949 and in Resolution 16 at General Council 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which both condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Stephen Strader, officially consider Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) as straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] I believe Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry are BIBLICAL
[ ] I believe Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry are IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
P.S. This letter and any response I receive from you will be posted at my blog site.
Also archived are the previous articles and letters I have written.
__________________________________________________________________
Sunday, May 25, 2008
A Commercial Break...
The only thing about this commercial is, they don't sponsor us. They don't pay me but I feel so strongly about these products that I want you to click on the links and buy them now... go ahead... do it now...
...HURRY before you spend the last of your paycheck on gum and pretzels!!
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Virtually every scripture has a matching study note with detailed information, explanation, and helpful insight. It helps to clarify difficult passages, bring unseen cultural and historical details to life, and help you understand and apply biblical truth.
I use this Bible and in my estimation have found it to be the most useful study bible in print today.
RAY COMFORT'S EVIDENCE BIBLE:
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...tools and insights to help Christians reason with those who need to come to a saving knowledge of Jesus Christ. I highly recommend it."
I also use this Bible and have found the apologetic notes to be exceedingly useful tools in my personal evangelism. HERE is a free pdf preview of the pages. In the side notes Ray Comfort helps you to learn how to show the absurdity of evolution, how to prove God's existence without the use of faith, how to prove the authenticity of the Bible through prophecy, and much more.
In addition, there are many notes and stories to help you see the need for, and encourage you to do more, personal evangelism. There is no other "witnessing bible" that even comes close to the usefulness of the Evidence Bible.
LED BY THE SPIRIT by JIM ELLIFF
Scroll past about 1/3 of the above web page to find "Led by The Spirit". Have you ever wished for a good concise explanation of how the Holy Spirit guides a believer? ME TOO! Well, have I got a book for you! Jim Elliff, President of Christian Communicators Worldwide has written a little pocket-sized book that explains biblically how to understand and follow the will and the leading of God. Order this booklet before you ever say again "I feel led" to do anything.
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How does God speak to us today? Does He actually make contact with us through personal revelation? Are there techniques we can use to contact God? Does God speak through latter-day apostles and prophets? Bob Dewaay's audio series answers these questions clearly and backed by biblical authority.
Saturday, May 24, 2008
Dear Pastor John Kilpatrick, We'd like clearer answers.
To Pastor John Kilpatrick:
Sir,
I sincerely appreciate you responding with a statement to my previous e-mail. Yours is the only response I have received of the 5 letters I have sent. But I am not satisfied with your statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of...
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...my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) you were "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
How could you, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe you do) be "duped" to do something like that?
Perhaps someone told you they were taking you to speak at the Assemblies of General Council but then took you to Florida instead?
(I'm very serious... If you were "duped" in any way I'd love to hear the story from you!)
In the end there are only three options I can see why you might have stood in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) You are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) You do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as your statement says you do. (at least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance)
(3) You were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe you Pastor Kilpatrick when you say that you hold doctrine in high regard, but I can't when you were thoughtless enough to put yourself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
You said in your statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations and they should have alarmed you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like you are attempting to say that you knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why you should now "fess up" (especially to your own congregation and the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches) and say
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Article 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And I was wrong to go on his stage."
Or maybe you are actually a Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter and are happy with your detail-lacking "Official Statement". If so I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world.
My two questions?...
1. Do you, Pastor John Kilpatrick, agree or disagree with the official stance and statements of the Assemblies of God as discussed at General Council in 1949 and 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Pastor John Kilpatrick, believe that Todd Bentley's doctrine and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) is straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS BIBLICAL
[ ] TODD BENTLEY'S DOCTRINE & MINISTRY IS IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you, Steve Hill, Stephen Strader, and Dr. George O. Wood if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
The only problem is that any answers you may give will have some consequences of strong criticism. I hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
God bless you.
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
I am also sending these questions to Steve Hill, Stephen Strader, and Dr. George O. Wood
_________________________________________________________________
UPDATE: I have posted the follow-up letters I sent to all recipients in THIS POST
UPDATE: Here is Pastor Stephen Strader's response to my "2-questions" letter
THERE IS AN ARTICLE CONCERNING THIS AT http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com ALSO
Sola Scriptura
Do we need tangible evidence of God's presence? Or is the Bible enough?
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The following is a section from
Why Evanglicals Are Returning To Rome: The Abandonment of Sola Scriptura as a Formal Principle
A Critical Issues Commentary by Bob DeWaay...
Spirituality for the Unconverted:
But why are literate American Christians running away from sola scriptura at a time when searching the Scriptures (especially using computer technology) has never been easier? On this point I am offering my opinion, but there is good evidence for it. I believe that the lack of gospel preaching has allowed churches to fill up with the unregenerate. The unregenerate are not like “newborn babes who long for the pure milk of the word” (1Peter 2:2). Those who have never received saving grace cannot grow by the means of grace. Those who are unconverted have not drawn near to God through the blood of Christ. But with mysticism, it is possible to feel near to God when one is far from Him. Furthermore, the unconverted have no means of sanctification because they do not have the imputed righteousness of Christ as their starting point and eternal standing. So they end up looking for man-made processes to engineer change through human works because they have nothing else.
And this section is in the conclusion.
But the life of faith does not require tangible visibility: “Now faith is the assurance of things hoped for, the conviction of things not seen” (Hebrews 11:1). The Roman Catholic Church has tangibility that is unmatched by the evangelical faith, just as temple Judaism had. Why have faith in the once-for-all shed blood of Christ that is unseen when you can have real blood (that of the animals for temple Judaism and the Eucharistic Christ of Catholicism)? Why have the scriptures of the Biblical apostles and prophets who are now in heaven when you can have a real, live apostle and his teaching Magisterium who can continue to speak for God? The similarities to the situation described in Hebrews are striking. Why have only the Scriptures and the other means of grace when the Roman Church has everything from icons to relics to cathedrals to holy water and so many other tangible religious articles and experiences?
I urge my fellow evangelicals to seriously consider the consequences of rejecting sola scriptura as the formal principle of our theology. If my Hebrews analogy is correct, such a rejection is tantamount to apostasy.
I do not believe that they are the only ones pursuing these things.
How many times lately have we heard,
"I want to feel you God", and that the glory is "tangible", and that we can reach out and touch the "glory cloud", and you too can see a vision, and that we should heed the words of some "Apostle" of God, speaking new words from God?
Do these things build our faith in God only because we can see, hear, and feel them?
Then it does NOT require faith.
Faith is being persuaded and sure of something, even though unseen.
Heb 11:6 But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.
Heb 11:7 By faith Noah, being divinely warned of things not yet seen, moved with godly fear, prepared an ark for the saving of his household, by which he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness which is according to faith.
He had only God's word and he acted on it.
Heb 11:8 By faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going.
Heb 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off were assured of them,embraced them and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.
Heb 11:39 And all these, having obtained a good testimony through faith, did not receive the promise,
Heb 11:40 God having provided something better for us, that they should not be made perfect apart from us.
They all looked ahead in faith for the coming Messiah.
Heb 12:1 Therefore we also, since we are surrounded by so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which so easily ensnares us, and let us run with endurance the race that is
set before us,
Heb 12:2 looking unto Jesus, the author and finisher of our faith, who for the joy that was set before Him endured the cross, despising the shame, and has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God.
This is our cloud of witnesses, those men and women of faith.
Faith doesn't require feeling, touch, sight, sound or smell.
For if these things are required so that you can believe, it is not by faith.
I thank you God that the Promise has come, and that You are with me always.
I have the assurance of Your Word. That is all I need.
In Christ
KDS
Friday, May 23, 2008
I think I was born a "Christian"
My church’s salvation message was, “You must ask forgiveness each time you sin, or you will go to hell. This didn't sound like "Good News" to me.
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I think I might have been born a “Christian”.
Well, almost, I was saved at around 8 yrs old. That’s just my guess, because I really can’t remember a time that I wasn’t saved. I had all the experiences that you think of when thinking about, speaking in tongues, interpretations, prophesies, being baptized in the Holy Ghost, and seeing people “slain in the spirit”, as it was called in my church.
I sought God every time I went to church, which was every time the doors were opened....It was a rule at our house. I would go to church camp and “feel” the “presence” of God, and come home hungry for a “move” in my local church. But then the high of His “presence” went away, and I felt the same as any other day. So I would go back to seeking God. My feelings at times were that God was not there. If I could not feel Him then maybe I had lost favor with Him. Maybe I had forgotten to ask forgiveness for a sin. The rapture was probably going to take place any second, and I probably did something bad today I forgot to ask forgiveness for, so I would be going to hell. This was my daily struggle. IN and OUT of salvation.
My church’s salvation message was, “You must ask forgiveness each time you sin, or you will go to hell, for even one sin.(NO, I was not Catholic, though it seems very similar now that I think about it)
There was no “Good News”...only condemnation.There was no mercy...only the realization that I WAS NOT PERFECT, and knew I could never stop sinning completely.
The first of my life I served a mean God that waited around for you to sin, then let you get hit by a truck so you would recieve your just reward.
This was not a merciful God.
Then as I got older I heard of a God that loves you so much that He could never send you to that bad place called hell. No matter what you did, He saw your heart, and that was all that mattered.
This is not a God of justice OR wrath.
It wasn’t until I came to realize that He is Just and He is Merciful that I came to know the True God, The God of the Holy Scriptures.
God is Merciful, Gracious,Loving,Just, Wrathful, Holy,Jealous, Patient,and much more.
I came to a place (through the Word of God)where I realized that I had never known this God.
I had chased after a God of my own making, and understanding.If this was the God of the Bible,
not only was I not born a Christian, I wasn’t a Christian at all!
I was actually the enemy of this God.
I was a sinner!
All my experiences in Church didn't save me.
I also came to see that they did not determine the state of my soul.
All they did was blind me to think I knew God,
because I thought my experiences were proof of my relationship with God.
When I was small and felt bad for my sins, my guilt never lead me to repent of my sins, it just made me sorry that I could never be perfect enough to go to heaven. I knew Jesus, He was the Son of God that died for me, and He was the One that I needed to confess my sins to daily, sometimes hourly, and then He would take them to God for my forgiveness. And my confessions would save me.
I was still trying to be good enough for MY God
but...I never realized that I needed to put my faith ONLY in Christ and His FINISHED work.
When I was older I knew that God loved me. And I found myself hoping He would just look at my heart and see that I truly loved Him back, and that would get me by.I guess I was just hoping that He loved me enough to let me slip past those pearly gates.
but...I never realized that I had sinned against a Holy God, and that He was a Just God that would punish all sin, no matter how much I thougt I “loved” Him, and that my heart was wicked, and I deserved His wrath.
In both of these beliefs I had only a part of the truth of salvation. Neither one will save me.
Christ alone is my salvation. I rest in Him knowing that He has done it all. I am nothing.
I deserve only the wrath of God for all my sins. He would not be a Just God if he did not pronounce me guilty. But He is a Just God.
In the scripture I finally found some “Good News”
It is AMAZING what happens when we actually take His Word and read it.
Not just listen to the preacher, and assume he is telling you the truth.
Not just hear a sermon, and take it as from the scriptures. But really study what God has said.
The One True God.
Not the God I was told about when I was 8, or the one I was introduced to as a teen.
But the God who is revealed in all of scripture.
Not just the scriptures about love for His children, but also about wrath on His enemies.
I came to see that His wrath was poured out on Jesus Christ in my place.He already took my punishment.
My deeds are nothing. My good intentions are nothing. He is everything.
We are not saved because we do not sin. We are saved because we rest in the fact that He (Jesus) was the Perfect, sinless sacrifice, that brought us into relationship with God.
Any christian that says they don't sin, lies. We are not made perfect by our sinless life, but by His.
When Jesus said, “It is finished” He was telling us that there is no longer any work that needed to be done for salvation. He was the only One who could have satisfied what God required for us to come to Him, which was a sinless sacrifice.
Paul Washer’s sermon in the blog,"How do you KNOW that you are saved?" doesn’t say, if you (christian) sin you are a sinner bound for eternity without God. He says that if you are a Christian the proof of it will be that you will not CONTINUE in you sin.
That means to live there, dwell there, practice it, and make it your lifestyle.
Your heart WILL BE (not might be, or should be) one of repentance toward God.
We are not saved by our deeds.Not by even by our lack of sinning. Because that would be a deed.
We are saved only by Christ and the shedding of His blood to remove all the sins of those who will have faith in Him alone for salvation.
But when I come to Him knowing I am not and never can be perfect on my own merit. He grants to us His righteousness, and His perfection. I daily see my sins as He sees them, and I hate them because He hates them, and I repent from them. I stop living in sin. It is no longer my dwelling place. It is not what I practice.
This does not mean I will never sin again, It means I will not stay there and rejoice in it, I will weep over it and turn from it.
I stop!
I repent!
This is not asking for forgiveness, He already forgave us when sin was nailed to the cross, and Christ’s work was done. This is stopping , and turning toward Him, broken by the mercy of God that would take an undeserving person like me, and give me eternal life through His Perfect Holy Son. If you are not broken over your sin, you do not hate it as God hates it.
Here is a quote I love
•If you can sin and not weep over it,you are an heir of hell! If you can go into sin,and afterwards feel satisfied to have done so,you are on the road to destruction.If there are no prickings of conscience, no inwardtorments, no bleeding wounds; if you have no throbs and heavings of a bosom that cannot rest; if your soul never feels filled with wormwood and gall when youknow you have done evil, you are no child of God!
--Charles H. Spurgeon
These feelings are there to tell us we have done wrong in God’s sight, and let us see that we could never be perfect enough to DESERVE His love and forgiveness, and this is why we cling ever so much more to the cross of Christ, because it is in Him and through Him alone that we find peace.
In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead."
Acts 17:30 -31
But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ. For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit.
Eph 2:13-18
But what things were gain to me, these I have counted loss for Christ. Yet indeed I also count all things loss for the excellence of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord, for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and count them as rubbish, that I may gain Christ, and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, the righteousness which is from God by faith; that I may know Him and the power of His resurrection, and the fellowship of His sufferings, being conformed to His death, if, by any means, I may attain to the resurrection from the dead.Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me. Philippians 3:7-12
There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death. For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
Romans 8:1-4
For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves to sin— because anyone who has died has been freed from sin. Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, he cannot die again; death no longer has mastery over him. The death he died, he died to sin once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God. In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires. Do not offer the parts of your body to sin, as instruments of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God, as those who have been brought from death to life; and offer the parts of your body to him as instruments of righteousness. For sin shall not be your master, because you are not under law, but under grace.
Rom 6:6 -14
I know I was born a "Christian"(sinner) but by the grace of God, now I am born again!
In Christ,
KDS
JUST IN: John Kilpatrick's Official Statement about Lakeland
I just received this Official Statement from John Kilpatrick's office.
Congrats Pastor Kilpatrick on being the first to at least say SOMETHING toward more discussion! (Where are you Dr. Wood?...Steve Hill...)
Hello Jon,
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement when questioned about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
PLEASE GO HERE to read my response to this statement.
UPDATE: I have listed the letters I sent to all recipients in THIS POST
Is the AG hiding out? No response to 4 out of 5 letters!
I hope that the Assemblies of God folks I wrote (Dr. George O. Wood, etc) are simply being prayerful and conferencing to decide how to clean up their involvement with the false "Florida Outpouring" revival in Lakeland.
But I'm afraid that they would rather be politically safe and leave all of their congregants outside the sheepfold of the word of God and allow them to be lost to this false prophet, false teacher and blaspheming heretic, Todd Bentley.
The "Winds of Change" angel of Todd has prophesied a worldwide revival... and I believe that it will come to pass. But is is not an angel of God that said it. And it is not a revival of repentence. And it is not a revival of New Life in Christ. It is a revival of the "Latter Rain" heresies of the 1940's and 1950's! And now the Assemblies of God is seemingly going to ignore its rising up again after a godly history of 50 years standing against it?!?!
Weep & pray for Todd Bentley, that his eyes would be open to the Truth.
As are all of us, he is a soul in need of Jesus...
Weep & pray for those who buy into this so-called revival...
Weep & pray for the AG Leadership who is endorsing, advertising and sponsoring Todd Bentley...
Weep & pray for those pastors who are so biblically illiterate that they would lead their congregants to desire this strange "Fresh Fire"...as if the "old one" isn't good enough!
And pray for me. I want to be used by God to further the Gospel and sometimes it takes chopping through some weeds to plant some seeds.
Thursday, May 22, 2008
AUDIO: Todd Bentley says it's NOT about Jesus?
UPDATE: Many have made the statement that "Todd didn't say "It's not about Jesus". This blog has never said that we are QUOTING Todd Bentley. There is a "?" at the end of the blog title. We know that he did not say the words "It's not about Jesus". However, we maintain that what he did say WAS that God told him to lay aside teaching on Jesus (for how long, Todd?) to bring the "angel" into Jesus' limelight.
So because the church supposedly doesn't believe in the "angel" of Todd, or in the "supernatural", God himself told Todd Bentley, in effect, 'Lay Jesus aside! Don't preach Jesus right now... preach about the angel and the supernatural because that's what the church needs.'
Do you not see the blasphemous heresy in that? And it can only mean that at this time "it's NOT about Jesus... its about the supernatural." So our title remains an accurate description of what Mr. Bentley said.
THE ORIGINAL POST FOLLOWS UNCHANGED:
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Well, I'm beginning to think that revivalist Todd Bentley may not really be hearing from God! In this audio clip I think he says that God told him not to worry about preaching Jesus but instead said "Todd, you've got to get people to believe in the angel" named Winds of Change, that visited Todd at the beginning of this revival!
I'll say it again... God told Todd Bentley that we need to know about his angel more than Jesus Christ...
Just soak up that "word from the Lord" prayerfully for a minute and listen to this short 2-minute clip: TEXT FOR THE HEARING IMPAIRED IS BELOW...
Okay. So, Todd, I hear what you're saying... if I don't believe your "story"...
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...without verification from the word of God, then "Sorry"? So I'm out of luck if I want to be a Berean and check you out? I'm out of luck if I want to be "rightly dividing the word of truth."!
I guess I should shun my Bible when it tells me to "shun profane and idle babblings, (like yours) for they will increase to more ungodliness. (2Tim 2:16)
And I should ignore 2 Timothy 2:17 when it tells me that your unbiblical message will spread like cancer like Hymenaeus' and Philetus'. Why do you want me to "stray concerning the truth"(2Tim 2:18)of the Word of God and simply put my faith your unbiblical story?
Also, what about:
1Corinthians 1:22-25 For Jews request a sign, and Greeks seek after wisdom; but we preach Christ crucified, to the Jews a stumbling block and to the Greeks foolishness, but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, CHRIST THE POWER of God AND THE WISDOM of God. Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
1Corinthians 2:2-5 - For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified. I was with you in weakness, in fear, and in much trembling. And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive words of human wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power, that your faith should not be in the wisdom of men but in (CHRIST) THE POWER of God.
and what about:
Matthew 12:39-40 - But (JESUS) answered and said to (THE PHARISEES), "An evil and adulterous generation seeks after a sign, and no sign will be given to it except the sign of the prophet Jonah. For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.
Todd, Jesus Christ is ALL we want from you and you are not preaching Him alone! He is ALL we need, and He is ALL you should be preaching!
I don't need or want anything "new"! I have the Gospel of Jesus Christ which is all the power I need!
And I don't need any "angel" to bring "winds of change" which are actually "every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting" which only "toss people about" from Sheveport to Kansas City to Toronto to Pensacola to Lakeland and everywhere in between without ever showing ANY FRUIT of REAL power, signs, wonders, or miracles!
Todd,... When "miracles" at this revival become more than people falling backwards and mothers having to go away "having faith" that their child has received his healing from his cancer having no proof that they are healed by Todd Bentley's annointing... (Jesus gave us immediate proof and total healing!)
When "signs" become more than airplane jetstreams falling into the shape of a cross in the sky and having thirteen 13 year olds on stage on the 13th day of the month ...
When "wonders" become more than pigeon angel feathers falling from the rafters, or glittery dandruff gold on your sports coat...
When "power" becomes more than Todd Bentley screaming "Bam! Boomba! Bam! Sheekaaaah! or even adding "...in the NAME of JESUUUUUUUsssssss"...
...but when Jesus Christ becomes the focal point and subject of every message (rather than the magic catchphrase) and the Holy Spirit does what the bible says He will do causing people to see their SIN as their problem and not their PROBLEMS as their problem...
THEN come and tell me about a "great revival".
Until then I will fight it and call it false, blasphemous, and heretical and will have the Word of God to back me up. So BAM!
TEXT OF THE ABOVE AUDIO:
This thing's gonna break out. Now, now, just wait up here... and Shrevesport (sic)... I'm releasing it back to where it all started in 1948. I'm releasing it back.
Now for some of you that are here, it doesn't really matter to you ... all that stuff. All you care about is ... God's moving. And you know what, that's all that really matters. So if you're not big on prophetic, supernatural, and angels, I'm sorry. It's my testimony. But if you want to know why God's moving, I have to tell you the whole story. And if you don't believe the story, well......sorry.
You know, I told the Lord, "why can't I just move in healing and forget talking about all that -other stuff?" He said, "Because, Todd you've got to get the people to believe in the angel." I said, "God, why do I want people to believe in the angel? Isn't it about getting the people to believe in Jesus?" He said, "The people already believe in Jesus, but the Church doesn't believe in the supernatural."
The Church has no problem believing in Jesus, what we don't believe in is the supernatural. We don't believe in angels. We don't believe in the prophetic. We don't believe in some of what's going on. And I'll tell you what, we need to have an awakening.
I said, "Well, God, maybe you want to give this ministry to somebody else, because nobody's going to receive it in the package that I come in." I said, "You gotta give me the most controversial testimony? You gotta visit me with all this supernatural stuff? I mean, hey, maybe if I was a little more clean-shaven and polished, people would believe me more." Or maybe, the world is looking for something new... How many of you believe we need something new?
HERE is the source video.
The first three minutes tells you about Todd & William Branham's shared "angel" named "Winds of Change" and the last two minutes are what you heard above.
CLICK HERE TO LISTEN TO TODD'S 2 MINUTE STORY ABOUT THE STINKY "RELEASE" OF A "SPIRIT OF INFIRMITY"
AUDIO: Todd Bentley and the stinky "spirit of infirmity"
At the great "outpouring" down in Lakeland, Florida, Todd Bentley tells a story where he says he cast out a demon "spirit of infirmity" that caused a woman gastric trouble for years... and take a guess how this spirit decided to exit... yep...... she "released" it!
...and I'm very sure a spirit of relief came upon her.
Also, for an extra way to sicken you, try to count how many times Todd blasphemes the Holy name of God.
Why does this "work of God" remind me of a bad Jerry Clower story?? And why do the people actually applaud the story at the end??
Be praying for those being deceived by this malarkey down in Florida.
(Don't get mad at me... I didn't MAKE you click that play button!)
(Runs 1:38 - from the Lakeland Florida Outpouring-5-21-08)
Wednesday, May 21, 2008
How do you KNOW that you are saved?
Man, this video just sticks a knife in your gut and twists!
Paul Washer - "How do you KNOW that you believe?" "If you don't have a new relationship with sin you don't have a new relationship with Christ!"
Pay close attention from the 2:00 to the 2:45 mark... BIF! POW! THWACK!
Go Brother Washer!
Other sites dealing with Todd Bentley:
I do not necessarily approve of, or disapprove of ;) , all of the content on these sites but they all have information that is important and relevant to the issue concerning Todd Bentley and the false Lakeland "Florida Outpouring" revival. Please check them out. (and tell 'em The Way sent ya!)
http://pjmiller.wordpress.com
http://sheepyweepy.wordpress.com/
http://filesfromtoni.blogspot.com/
http://discerningtheworld.wordpress.com/
http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/
http://livingjourney.wordpress.com/
http://churchwarnings.blogspot.com/
http://lakelandrevival.blogspot.com/
An Open Letter: The Assemblies of God re: Todd Bentley
Today I received a response to my letter to the Assemblies of God National Headquarters concerning the Lakeland "Florida Outpouring" revival that has been going on now for about 50 days. It was a worthless response that did not answer my direct questions. It said...
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READERS: Please post and link to this letter wherever possible. If you have friends or family in an Assembly of God church, e-mail it to them. We must get the word out as much as we can!
If you have any concern about this you could also write a letter:
General Council of the Assemblies of God
1445 N. Boonville Avenue
Springfield, MO 65802-1894
Or call the AG:
Phone: 417-862-2781
Or e-mail the guys I e-mailed:
•General Superintendent, Dr. George Wood: gwood@ag.org
•Peninsular FL Dist. Supt, Terry Raburn: traburn@penflorida.org
•AG Public Relations Director, Keith Surface: ksurface@ag.org
•Steve Hill's church: contact@stevehill.org
•John Kilpatrick's church: ministry@johnkilpatrick.org
Today I received a response to my letter to the AG National Headquarters concerning the Lakeland "Florida Outpouring" revival that has been going on now for about 50 days. It was a worthless response that did not answer my direct questions. It said:
Jon,
Typically, the Assemblies of God does not issue statements on local revivals. I have checked with our leadership and no statements are planned at this time.
Keith Surface (AG Public Relations Director)
The response I got from the AG Peninsular Florida District Superintendent was worthless as well.
Good afternoon, Brother Sharp.
We do not have an official position on this revival. It is hosted by a Sovereign church and the evangelist is not credentialed with the Assemblies of God. My schedule has not allowed me an opportunity to attend the services.
Blessings to you.
Sincerely,
Terry Raburn - PFDC Superintendent
The problem is that this Florida revival started at and it is hosted by AG pastor Stephen Strader at Ignited Church... an official Assembly of God Church. I was not sure what they meant by "It is hosted by a Sovereign Church... and this certainly is not a "local" revival, so I replied with an open letter which I will post below:
To:
Dr. George Wood (AG General Superintendent),
Terry Raburn (AG Peninsular Fl. District Superintendent),
Keith Surface (AG Public Relations Director),
Steve Hill (AG Pastor, Heartland Church),
John Kilpatrick (AG Pastor, Church of His Presence)
Sirs,
I'm a nobody. And though I was raised in the AG I am not credentialed. But I certainly can plainly see that the AG has some direct involvement in this movement and that they also have some responsibilities because of that involvement.
Brother Raburn, are you saying Ignited Church is not an AG church or that it is not hosting the revival? If not hosting they are surely promoting:http://www.ignitedchurch.com/
Ignited Church shows on your national website as an AG church.And Stephen Strader shows as its AG minister.
PHOTO: Todd Bentley being interviewed by CBN displaying Ignited Church logo in background.
http://ag.org/top/church_directory/index.cfm?Display=Yes&churchdetail=4cb575be-b3d7-46bc-8c91-da78f346a3b9
If "Sovereign" churches are ones not associated with the AG please tell me how I can get a listing for my church on your web site!
Todd Bentley's website shows it as an Assembly of God church...
http://www.freshfire.ca/index.php?Act=read&status=revival&Id=148&pid=954&bid=923
Please give me the AG definition of a sovereign church.
Let me assure you that I am not being antagonistic. I have a sincere concern that many thousands of AG congregants are being deceived by this false revival. And my claim that it is a false revival is substantiated many places but none quite as nicely as in your own position paper.
http://ag.org/top/Beliefs/Position_Papers/pp_endtime_revival.cfm
Yet, I am becoming extremely concerned that this IS an Assembly of God revival and that the Assemblies of God are ignoring their own position paper in this instance.
It says in part:
...We believe that God's Spirit never goes where His Word does not. . . . We have been lambasted by elements of the electronic church and charismatic renewal as being backslidden and non-Spirit led when we have not jumped on popular bandwagons of the day loaded with the meringue of personality and spiritual excess rather than the plain meat of God's Word. So be it! If criticism is the price we must pay for asking the question: "What saith the Lord in His written Word?"-then let us wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ...
Would you be so bold to be criticized now? Has the desire for "fidelity to Christ" left the AG in just 8 years? It would benefit the organization if you would dust this paper off and do what it says and judge this revival, its participants and your pastors by what it says.
Of grave concern to me is this. Two of the top Assembly of God pastors (Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick) stood on Todd Bentley's stage and "blessed" Mr. Bentley as a man of God and they blessed the revival as a move of God.
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQqe8BJm12g )
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEIp11FnuSg&feature=related)
So in effect, to myself, your national congregation, and in fact, the world, the Assemblies of God HAS already made a statement regarding this "Latter Rain" revival. That is the real problem. In fact, http://firstagvictoria.org/ has a link to Todd's page. Is one group big enough for you to be concerned about? I'm sure there are many more planning trips if they haven't already been there.
And, sirs, this is a "local revival" like the Super Bowl is a "local" football game! I live in Texas and am already steeped in talk about this revival. Do a little Google search and see how local it is. It is an issue of national concern and there are many Assembly of God members being affected and are "going to get some" because of the Pentecostal/charismatic flavor of the meetings.
Sirs, this revival is a hand grenade that the AG may decide they would rather not deal with "at this time". But you don't have to be a Florida Outpouring Prophet to see that pretty soon it will blow up in your faces.
I know that Mr. Surface is just the talking head for the AG and that it must be difficult for both he and the organization to make a statement because it is an uncomfortable rock/hard place situation with the involvement of Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick, but for the souls who are at stake I must demand some kind of direct answers to my individual questions... even if they are worthless political ones.
I'll repeat the questions:
I'd like to know the official statements of the Assemblies of God regarding the Lakeland "Florida Outpouring" revival in general.If there are no official statements please make up something besides "the Assemblies of God does not issue statements on local revivals....and no statements are planned at this time". Perhaps it is time to plan and make a statement.
I'd also like an official statement concerning the specific people who are involved directly with the movement. I'd like, at minimum, a statement of endorsement or refusal to endorse each of these people with reasons:
1. Todd Bentley (a latter rain student, Joel's Army, who claims true apostleship based on a "visitation" by Jesus & Paul)
2. Patricia King
3. Joshua Mills
4. Bob Jones
5. Paul Cain
6. Rick Joyner
7. Bobby Connor
8. Steve Hill
9. John Kilpatrick
and might as well add
10. Stephen Strader.
I'd also like to know: Does/has/will the Assemblies of God, either on the local level or national level, encourage(d) or send (sent) any pastors to attend this revival. and more specifically were Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick sent by the organization (an authorized/church-paid trip) or did they go on their own funds and their own volition.
and:Do/have/will you recommend(ed) that pastors give any particular position concerning the revival from the pulpit.
I am blogging about this issue (http://blog.thewaycf.com/2008/05/are-assemblies-of-god-endorsing-todd.html) and I will post this as an "open letter". I intend to keep my readers informed concerning these correspondences.
Again, this is all based on my burden for ay AG friends, family and acquaintances and is not meant to be antagonistic. Please know that if the AG has left its desire to live by biblical standards and it's refusal to attach itself to this new "Latter Rain" (http://www.freshfire.ca/index.php?Act=read&status=prophetic&Id=2&pid=954 see "Restoration & Convergence") "Joel's Army" (http://www.freshfire.ca/index.php?Act=read&status=prophetic&Id=9&pid=954) revival that I must be as vocal and public as possible about that decision for those I love. The AG would have backed me at one time:
http://www.ag.org/top/Beliefs/sptlissues_imparting_spiritual_gifts.cfm
http://enrichmentjournal.ag.org/199904/084_lessons.cfm
http://www.ag.org/top/events/General_Council_1999/19990811_councils_30_40.cfm
Please help to quench this false revival wildfire. Now is the time, before it is too late.
Prayerfully, In Christ,
Jon Sharp
Oh how the Assemblies have changed since 1949 when they refused to support the "Latter Rain" movement. Today the "Latter Rain, New Apostolic, Joel's Army" movement is crawling back out of its hole and checking to see if the same men of God are in place at Springfield. I guess I'm checking to see as well.
We'll see what response we get and will post it here.
UPDATE: As of 5-26-08 I have had no response from any except John Kilpatrick which is HERE
UPDATE: HERE is my second letter to the Assemblies of God leadership.
Tuesday, May 20, 2008
Are the Assemblies of God endorsing Todd Bentley?
I was raised in the Assemblies of God and thankfully had mostly biblically-literate leaders. I have now cut my AG/pentecostal/Armenian roots but I do, however, have many godly friends and loved-ones remaining in the organization and hold many Assembly of God pastors in high regard as men of God even though I may disagree with them on some non-essential doctrinal issues. I have appreciated Steve Hill...
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...putting sin and repentance in the forefront of his messages when I have heard him.
These days in many pentecostal/charismatic churches, if a biblically illiterate pastor can get a biblically illiterate congregation to vote him in, pretty much anything goes. And those congregations are the most likely to go after this type of false outpouring.
That the AG does not generally maintain control over what their pastors teach or what books, revivals, videos, etc they endorse in their local churches and does not actively reprimand and or remove pastors who don't eschew these types of unbiblical and/or heretical practices is unbelievable to me and the fruit of that failure will be a huge problem during this "revival".
Ultimately, when extra-biblical "signs and wonders" or teachings/prophecies are claimed, pentecostal/charismatic organizations are afraid to speak out against them because to do so would shatter much of their history and discredit many of their former "saints of God".
They think that by speaking against any "manifestation" they are "grieving the Spirit" and "putting God in a box". I heard Bob DeWaay relate an illustration about putting God in a box. It was something like this...
We don't put God in a box... He puts US in a sheepfold. And the protective fence He gave us in the New Covenant age is the Word of God, the Bible! He gave us boundries so we could stay safe, KNOW Him, and please Him. The fence is our measuring rod. It says that what is inside is safe. What is outside is error. It is by the bible alone that we may judge rightly how far we can go. The extra-biblical signs, wonders, miracles, manifestations etc. are the garbage that the wolves (false prophets and false teachers) have laid outside the fence to tempt us into venturing out and they will be our destruction.
Thomas Brooks wrote that God's "fence" has two attributes:
1. protection (Job 1:10), "Haven't You placed a hedge around him, his household, and everything he owns?"
2. affliction (Hosea 2:6-8), "I will hedge up her path with thorns. I will wall her in..."
The hedge of protection—is to keep His people from danger.
The hedge of affliction—is to stop His people from wandering.
The hedge of protection—is to keep them in God's way.
The hedge of affliction—is to keep them out of sin's way.
The hedge of protection—is to keep them from suffering.
The hedge of affliction—is to keep then from sinning, and to put them upon returning to God.
Presently the Assemblies of God has a huge problem if they wanted to make a statement against Todd Bentley since two of their most public, well known pastors (Steve Hill and John Kilpatrick) have now stood on Mr. Bentley's stage and given their blessings calling the Florida revival a "move of God" and Todd Bentley a "man of God".
I'm angry and sad... and seeing AG Leadership on Todd Bentley's stage was the last straw for me. I want the AG to be held accountable to make a statement for the huge mistake made by Steve Hill and John Kilpatrick in which they have made the garbage outside the fence look good to the sheep,... leading untold numbers to error. That hurts.
So I'm calling the AG out. What will the official statement be from any AG leader concerning this "Florida Outpouring"? As a pentecostal denomination they must see that their people will be drawn to this and that they have an obligation to guide people to either support or denounce this so-called revival.
I wrote the Superintendent Terry Raburn at the AG Peninsular Florida District Council seeking an official statement and they wrote back saying:
Brother Sharp,
We do not have an official position on this revival. It is hosted by a Sovereign church and the evangelist is not credentialed with the Assemblies of God. My schedule has not allowed me an opportunity to attend the services.
Blessings to you.
Sincerely,
Terry Raburn, PFDC Superintendent
I have also sent the letter to the Assemblies of God General Council asking for a formal statement concerning the "Florida Outpouring" and those directly associated with it including:
1. Todd Bentley
2. Patricia King
3. Joshua Mills
4. Bob Jones
5. Paul Cain
6. Rick Joyner
7. Bobby Connor
8. Steve Hill
9. John Kilpatrick
I have also asked them to provide at minimum a statement of endorsement or refusal to endorse with reasons and asked them if the AG organization has or will encouraged or sent any pastors to attend this revival, and if they have recommended or will recommend that pastors give any particular position concerning the revival from the pulpit.
If the General Council will maintain support for the actions of their pastors Steve Hill and John Kilpatrick they must in agreement publicly call Todd Bently a man of God and the "Florida Outpouring" a move of God.
Otherwise they should publicly denounce what their pastors said and stick to the statements they laid out at General Council, August 13, 2000 which, incidentally, was in Orlando, Florida!.
The AG Position Paper linked above says in part: (bold emphasis is mine)
...We believe that God's Spirit never goes where His Word does not. . . . We have been lambasted by elements of the electronic church and charismatic renewal as being backslidden and non-Spirit led when we have not jumped on popular bandwagons of the day loaded with the meringue of personality and spiritual excess rather than the plain meat of God's Word. So be it! If criticism is the price we must pay for asking the question: "What saith the Lord in His written Word?"-then let us wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ...
...Just as Scripture tells us a prophecy must be judged (1 Corinthians 14:29), so should an unusual physical response be judged. Is the physical demonstration the result of the Spirit’s conviction resting heavily on a sinner? In revivals of earlier centuries, conviction has led sinners to groan, to weep, and even to scream as the fear of eternal damnation gripped the soul. Such "manifestations" seem entirely appropriate, if they are sincere expressions leading to conversion.
Reports of souls saved and lives changed should never justify wrong theology and practices. Yet Paul said about the false prophets who were causing him and his ministry frustration, "Christ is proclaimed in every way whether out of false motives or true; and in that I rejoice" (Philippians 1:15-18). But Paul obviously wanted Christ to be proclaimed from right motives and with biblical integrity. So do we.
"So do we."? Then to you, Assemblies of God, I say, "Prove it!" Give us a statement concerning the "Florida Outpouring."
SEE MY "OPEN LETTER" TO AG GENERAL SUPERINTENDENT DR. GEORGE WOOD:
http://blog.thewaycf.com/2008/05/open-letter-assemblies-of-god-re-todd.html
UPDATE: Since I have had no response (as of 5-26-08) I sent a second letter to the Assemblies of God leadership which can be read HERE.
Monday, May 19, 2008
Todd Bentley: Do we have anything to worry about?
You tell me. Todd Bentley has literally changed his story! The question is, what makes a minister feel he must remove information that he had previously said was vital to revival coming to the "Florida Outpouring"? Where did Emma go and why did she all of a sudden become so "particular"? Take a look at...
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...this article over at Slice of Laodicea about Todd Bentley's angelic visitation by an "angel" named Emma:
http://www.sliceoflaodicea.com/?p=718
The same story about the "angel" named "Emma" is contained here... plus a lot more interesting information:
http://documents.scribd.com/docs/247to5o9nxze25ql1kt8.pdf
These articles are based on an article Todd Bentley wrote. It is posted here:
(go way down to part 3 - paragraph 15)
http://www.etpv.org/2003/angho.html
NOW, after reading all about the angel "Emma" (written by Todd himself) look how Todd Bentley has NOW CHANGED his "angelic visitation" story on his ministry website to be somewhat less controversial by removing all references to "Emma":
http://www.freshfire.ca/index.php?Act=read&status=teaching&Id=40&pid=954 (paragraph 2)
Why do you suppose he would so drastically change his story?... Does he now feel compelled to hide the name of "Emma" and if so, why?
Whaddaya think?... Do we possibly have something to worry about concerning the origins of Todd Bentley's spirituality?
You be the judge. (1Cor. 5:11-12 -But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler--not even to eat with such a one. For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge?)
Also please visit this article about Todd Bentley:
http://blog.thewaycf.com/2008/05/whats-being-served-at-todd-bentleys.html
Saturday, May 17, 2008
What's being served at Todd Bentley's Florida Outpouring?
The passion of Todd's life and ministry: is to see others set free through the anointing of the Holy Spirit and to see others come into the reality of intimate relationship with Jesus. He also desires to see Christ's body healed, equipped and rising up in the power of the Holy Spirit to fulfill the great commission.
Really?? I would argue that that is a patently false statement! And I believe Todd's method of operation proves it!
I have watched the...
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...live footage of the "Florida Outpouring" Revival from Lakeland, Florida on GODTV for many nights now and have seen practically NO preaching or teaching of the Word of God by Mr. Bentley. In a basic count I did on paper, there was one mention of the name of Jesus (about 10 in three hours) for every two mentions (21) of the Holy Spirit. And in that same time there were over 200 mentions of glory, glory clouds, healings, signs, wonders, impartations, portals, angels, angelic visitations, etc..etc..
Mr. Bentley's continual M.O. (even before this so-called revival) has been to place great emphasis on dreams, visions, mystical revelations, angelic visitations, "impartations", and direct communication with the spirit-world through various new-age techniques including meditation and "seeing" into the "Spirit Realm". These types of unbiblical, antibiblical, and extrabiblical activities and "revelations" all originated in pagan ritual and/or Roman Catholic, Eastern Religion or New Age mysticism.
If Mr. Bentley is a "revivalist" that wants to see people in a relationship with Christ and to see those same people fulfilling the great commission, then why is there no preaching of repentance to speak of in Lakeland?
In fact, Mr. Bentley places such great emphasis on the supernatural that he CONSISTENTLY FAILS to quote scripture, preach or teach scripture, or read scripture... so much so, in fact that He also CONSISTENTLY FAILS to mention sin, repentance, the wrath and judgement of God toward sinners and false converts, and the saving Gospel of Jesus Christ which culminates in us being born again into New Life... which is what revival should be!
Charles Spurgeon said:
There are crowds of preachers and reverend divines now-a-days in the world; but all are not ministers of God who are so called... There are a thousand things that claim to be of the Holy Ghost; how can we know whether they are or not? Here is a simple mode of discovering... "He shall glorify me." (John 16:14)
Perhaps, in Florida, the Holy Spirit is so intent on "slaying" people and causing people to shake, quake and "vibrate" that He forgot to glorify Jesus and draw men to repentance. Maybe the Holy Spirit is so busy fixing hurt backs and knees etc. that He just doesn't want Todd to waste any time glorifying Jesus by preaching the inspired, revealed Word of God! Maybe the Holy Spirit has changed his mind about not glorifying Himself and now wants everyone to see His great deeds! Maybe He decided to put Jesus on the back-burner for awhile while He takes some credit for some "creative miracles" with signs like gold dust on clothing, olive oil seeping from pores, angel feathers falling from the rafters, or gold fillings miraculously appearing in your teeth!
I'm truly sad to say that the farthest I've seen Todd Bentley go toward "seeing others come into the reality of intimate relationship with Jesus" is when he takes one or two minutes (out of three or four hours) to pray a prayer that those who would like to "accept Jesus" should repeat.
Now some may not like this, but the bible never implies or states that simply leading a sinner in (or repeating) a sinner's prayer makes a sinner "good-to-go" in his "intimate relationship with Jesus"! Unfortunately, that's ALL that Mr. Bentley does. No explanation of sin, God's righteousness, justice, wrath, judgement, grace, etc... No Gospel at all. Just a prayer. And a false hope in that false prayer that leads a sinner with false emotions to a false conversion while he continues to store wrath up for himself.
Since watching the "Florida Outpouring" Revival for many nights, I've watched it go from venue to venue, and apparently grow into a new "revival" phenomenon which Charisma Magazine now generally associates with the "Toronto Outpouring" and the "Brownsville Revival" because of its length of continuance and the supposed miraculous signs, wonders and healings. Thankfully, though this new "outpouring" is not associated with any particular local church body or denomination so maybe some of the damage will be contained.
And that brings up another point! What's up, Steve Hill?
( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQqe8BJm12g )
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEIp11FnuSg&feature=related)
Sir, the fact that you would associate with this motley group of false prophets, false teachers, heretics, and new-age mystics saddens me and discredits anything positive I might have been able to think about your ministry!
Yes, I heard you saying you have a desire to see souls saved through this revival, but tell me... do you honestly believe that the healed toothache is what leads men to repentance?? Do you really think that souls will be saved en masse through false teachers and false prophets?!
By giving your "blessing" to Todd Bentley and this revival you have (by association) blessed the unbiblical and/or heretical ministries of the likes of Bob Jones, Joshua Mills, Patricia King, Rick Joyner, Paul Cain, John Arnott, Denny Cline, Benny Hinn, Bobby Connor, and many more who are continually bringing destructive heresies, false prophecies and dangerous ideas into the church.
And about your statement that the world is crying "Show me something (supernatural), Church, and I will believe"...???? What about Matt 12:38-39? If this evil and adulterous Phariseeic generation claims that they can't see our God without some hokey sign or worthless prophecy, it is (a) because they desire to remain in their sin, or (b) no one has preached the True Gospel to them (Romans 10:14-17) or (c) because they have been promised liberty and been deceived by these false teachers who "will utterly perish in their own corruption, and will receive the wages of unrighteousness."
So unless Todd Bentley decides to let the life-giving, refreshing, reviving, Gospel of Jesus come out from under his tired, "been-there, done-that-Third Wave-Outpouring" to get some air, he will continue to drown out any hope for true revival that results, not in signs and wonders and angelic visitations, but in repentance and in faith in Jesus Christ alone for any hope of righteousness and salvation.
2Timothy 4:2-5 Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables. But you be watchful in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry.
Thursday, May 8, 2008
Jesus paid MOST of my debt?
My favorite verses in the Bible are in the book of Colossians 2:13-14. This is the entire story of what Jesus did for you in just two short verses!
Here's what it says;
You were at one time spiritually dead because of your...
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...sins and because you were Gentiles without the Law. But God has now brought you to life with Christ. God forgave us all our sins; He canceled the unfavorable record of our debts with its binding rules and did away with it completely by nailing it to the cross.
Let's take a closer look at it in smaller pieces.
You were at one time spiritually dead…(Without the forgiveness Jesus provides, we are DEAD because we are separated from God who IS Life. Because of our sin we are bound for hell!)
...because of your sins…(I am guilty. You are guilty. I broke His Law so I deserve to burn in hell! Any good judge would send a guilty man to be punished!)
...and because you were Gentiles without the Law. (We broke the perfect Law of God and as non-Jews we didn't even have any way to make a sacrifice to cover up our sins! That's a HUGE PROBLEM! A death sentence with no way to appeal or pay the fine!)
But… (the Solution to our problem was given to us!!! Keep reading...)
...God has now brought you to life with Christ. (Until we receive the free gift of LIFE that Jesus offers us, we are DEAD. The only way to be "brought to Life" is through Jesus Christ. Jesus said, "I am the Way, the Truth and the Life." No on can come to Life (which is a relationship with God, the Giver of Life) except through full trust, faith, belief and rest knowing that Jesus is the ONLY way to be right with God. Then your life WILL show if your belief and faith are true through your desire to turn away from sin and desiring that all men come to know Jesus as you have.
God forgave us all our sins; (Notice that sin did NOT go unpunished! God DID judge us guilty and the punishment for OUR sin was taken by Jesus. He took the death sentence we deserved to pay. He paid the fine of our sin which was DEATH! ....And how many of our sins were forgiven? Just the ones I have already committed? Just the ones I remembered to confess? Just the big ones? NO! the scripture says it CLEARLY! He forgave ALL OF THEM! Romans 6:10 says Jesus died once for ALL sin!)
He canceled the unfavorable record of our debts…(God's record of OUR sin was erased!...even though we had not even been born, all of our sin was dealt with before we even committed them! That's how our FUTURE sins are ALREADY FORGIVEN... They were ALL "future sins" when Jesus finished the work it took to forgive them. What work did it take to forgive my sin? His DEATH! That's why He said with His last breath "IT IS FINISHED!" Everything that could EVER be done to forgive the sin of the world was FINISHED AT THAT MOMENT!
No additional "asking for forgiveness" will get any more sins forgiven... they were ALL forgiven! No baptism, communion, tithing, offerings, or good deeds will get you any closer to God... because when you come to God through the work of Jesus on the cross and His resurrection you have a FULL and TOTAL heir-ship! You are COMPLETELY and PERFECTLY Sons of God. You are counted RIGHTEOUS because of what Jesus did. Not because of ANYTHING you have done, will do, or CAN do!)
...with its binding rules… (God demands that we be PERFECT, and SINLESS to have a relationship with Him... but we are SINFUL, LUSTFUL, PRIDEFUL, MESS-UPS. Since He MADE US, He knew that we could not and would not keep His perfect LAW! But the neat thing is that He actually really gave it to us ONLY to point us to His Son Jesus, who is the ONLY way for us to trade our SIN for Jesus' PERFECTION. We are bankrupt but we are "credited" Jesus' righteousness in God's sight)
...and did away with it completely… (God gave us TWO CHOICES. 1. We must agree to obey His binding, legal requirements and abide by His Law perfectly. However if we don't obey perfectly, we will suffer His death sentence. OR 2. We can accept His Son, Jesus Christ, as our ransom, as the Payment for our death penalty fine and we can be "crucified with Him" according to Romans 6:6-8. And what about those "binding rules"? If you trade them for Jesus' work, they're GONE! -- What about our sin? The past sins?...GONE! The present sins?...GONE! And even the FUTURE SINS?!!...GONE! Then our ransomed relationship with Jesus is shown to be authentic through our repentance from sin and our ongoing faith in Jesus' finished work.)
...by nailing it to the cross. (All of the above is available to us TODAY, because of what Jesus Christ did 2000 years ago! You cant read these verses any other way!)
An old church hymn says;
JESUS PAID IT ALL, ALL TO HIM I OWE...
SIN HAD LEFT A CRIMSON STAIN,
HE WASHED IT WHITE AS SNOW
Everything that needed to be done to save us and forgive our sins was FINISHED 2000 years ago when Jesus died on the cross (He conquered SIN) and when He rose from the dead (He conquered DEATH)
So, since He paid the fine for OUR death sentence, (The wages of sin is death) and since He loves us completely, and since He is the Son of God, God made flesh, HE has the right to offer us Total Forgiveness and Eternal Life!
Now that's GOOD NEWS!
Quotes to make you mad... or make you pray!
What can I say. Here are some hard-hitting quotes to chew on.
Don't leave this page without reading them carefully. Leave a comment to let me know what you think!
• "Has your religion cost you...
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...anything? If it has cost you nothing, it is worth nothing." ~William Tiptaft
• "It is my opinion that tens of thousands of people, if not millions, have been brought into some kind of religious experience by "accepting" Christ, and they have not been saved. If your Christian conversion did not reverse the direction of your life, if it did not transform it then you are not converted at all. You are simply a victim of the "accept Jesus" heresy!" ~A.W. Tozer
• "The vast majority of people who are members of churches in America today are not Christians. I say that without the slightest contradiction. I base it on empirical evidence of 24 years of examining thousands of people." ~D. James Kennedy
• "If you can sin and not weep over it, you are an heir of hell! If you can go into sin, and afterwards feel satisfied to have done so, you are on the road to destruction. If there are no prickings of conscience, no inward torments, no bleeding wounds; if you have no throbs and heavings of a bosom that cannot rest; if your soul never feels filled with wormwood and gall when you know you have done evil, you are no child of God!" ~Charles H. Spurgeon
• "I have gotten hurt more by my GOOD works than my bad ones.My bad works always drove me to the Savior for mercy; my good works often kept me from Him, and I began to trust in myself." ~Ralph Erskine
• "One design of God in the gospel is to bring us to make God the object of our undivided respect, that...he may be the center of it; that God may be all in all. ~Jonathan Edwards
• "An unregenerate world judges God as being the guilty party for the sufferings of humanity. As far as they are concerned, He is unjust. But the Law of God gives sudden light to their misconception. We are the ones who are in transgression. In light of God's holiness, it is hard to understand why He continues to let a sinful race such as ours even draw another breath." ~Ray Comfort
• "If you think that you do deserve anything at all from God beyond the wrath which you have so richly earned, you merely show your ignorance of spiritual principles. ~Donald Grey Barnhouse
Monday, May 5, 2008
To be is to do... do-be-do-be-do.
"Try not. Do, or do not. There is no try..." These are the words of Yoda, the muppet Jedi Master, from the movie "The Empire Strikes Back". Though I have often quoted these words while doing a petty fantastic Yoda impersonation, I've always thought of the words as pseudo-wisdom because of the source. I will usually shy away from using a secular movie to make a biblical point, but in my growing frustration with the idea of people "trying to live a Christian life"...
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I have recently come to see that these words make a biblical point. The true problem with our faith in Christ is that we often "try" to "keep the faith".
We "try" to be good Christians. We "try" to flee from Satan or temptation. We "try" to be loving and forgiving. We "try" to be good little Christians, by "trying" to be faithful to pray, and "trying" to read our Bibles, and "trying" to make it to church. We "try" not to get discouraged. We "try" to keep our eyes on Jesus. We "try" to be strong. We "try" to be a good witness. And we "try" to put on the Armor of God and "try" to bear the Fruit of the Spirit.
The problem is that Jesus never said "Try to love your neighbor..." or "Try to forgive your enemies..." "Try to come unto me..." or "Try to preach the Gospel and make disciples..."!
Jesus never, ever told anyone to "try" to do anything. He always simply commanded with authority or simply stated that in a relationship with Him that we "would" do this or that.
I propose that this is the problem for many who think they are "Christians", yet they "DO" nothing! They just keep trying! I say if you are "trying" you are doomed (eternally) to a false Christianity! There truly is NO "TRY" in Christ Jesus!
I'm sick of all the "trying". Where is the "fruit"? Where is the "DOING",... where is the "BEING"?! When will we finally come to a place of action? We don't "try" to enter into the true Sabbath rest. We just ENTER IT when we are truly in Christ. It is the Supernatural Fruit of the New Nature we have received. In Christ we KNOW that we are in Christ, we KNOW that we are under God's wings, we KNOW that the Spirit dwells in us, sealing us as heirs. We KNOW that to live is Christ and to die is gain, we KNOW whom we have believed, and we KNOW that he is able, and that he will, and that in Him it is Yes, and Amen!
It doesn't take a wrinkled, green muppet to reveal this Truth to a True Convert! If the Holy Spirit dwells within, we just DO the things that he leads us to do and we bear the Fruit of His presence in our life! How is it that we can say that we are "led by the Spirit" and yet we also say "I'm TRYING to believe.", "I'm TRYING to have faith.", or "I'm TRYING to repent from that sin."?
Can we call Luke Skywalker a true "Jedi" if he only "tries" to be a Jedi? No! He just IS a Jedi! He will DO IT! He will PROVE IT! He will BE a Jedi, and his life will bear witness, proving his "Jedi-anity" by his doing the "works" of a Jedi, and bearing the "Fruit" of "the Force". Until that point he is nothing but a nerf herder.
What about you, so-called "Christian"? Are you bearing any Fruit? Are you BEING who and what Jesus said you would be? Are you DOING & LIVING what Jesus and the writers of the New Testament said you would do if you were truly in Christ? If you are just "trying" and not "doing", then the Biblical truth shows that you are most likely not truly "in Christ"!
Thursday, May 1, 2008
They Hate Me... and I'm Glad!
In life, negative images generally serve to block the positive mental views we have of the world.
As an example, think "Twin Towers" "O.J. Simpson" and "Phuket, Thailand". We no longer think about the "Center of International Commerce", the "Heisman Trophy Winner", or the "Oceanside Paradise". Those former images are now obscured with images of terrorism, murder and tsunami.
Why is it that, when a celebrity...
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...is seen in his natural habitat, it's rarely a more positive view of them that we receive? Look at the recent candid views we've had of the life of celebrities like Alec Baldwin, David Hasselhoff, and "Dog the Bounty Hunter" Duane Chapman. The TV and real-life bounty hunter was the latest celebrity to have his true, hateful, racial opinions publicly revealed in a candidly recorded telephone call. And what a revelation it was! The girl who was the object of Mr. Chapman's rant was was distilled by him to the worst thing he could think of about her.... namely her color. Once a celebrity lets his mouth fly there's no going back. He was once known as our old pal "Dog the Bounty Hunter", but from now on, to many in America, he'll always be "Duane Chapman, Racist".
The same is true of Michael Richards who played the bumbling Cosmo Kramer on the sitcom "Seinfeld". He was funny, easy to watch, and he seemed like an old friend or buddy. But now those pleasant mental pictures have been pushed to the back of our minds... directly behind Mr Richards' real-life racist tirade. Now our "relationship" with him is different. We've seen his "true colors" and many of us are no longer comfortable with him. To many, he is no longer our TV friend... he's a "racist actor."
Polls show that around eighty-five percent of Americans call themselves "Christian". Yet the vast majority of those 85% are generally at peace with a sinful world. I say that because they are not hated by the world! In fact, some internationally-known "Christians" like Rick Warren and Joel Osteen are flat-out loved by even the non-Christian world.
Jesus said "...everyone will hate you because you are my followers" (Luke 21:7) If the world does not hate Joel Osteen (or at least his message), how can we say Mr. Osteen is a "follower of Christ"? If the world does not hate Rick Warren, how can we say Mr. Warren is a "follower of Christ"?
There is a noticible "lack of hate" for Christians in the United States. I don't see many people being despised for their intolerance of sin or for preaching repentance of sin and the wrath of God. I don't see many being beaten or killed for holding church services or distributing bibles. In fact, I don't see many people in my daily life doing anything that we would classify as "Christian Activity". This is the biblical proof that the vast majority of self-proclaimed "Christians" are not truly saved! They call themselves "Christian" yet they have never "sold all and followed Jesus". They have never "picked up their cross". They have never been"crucified with Christ". They have never been "born again". Therefore they are NOT Christians... they are NOT really saved.
Are you really saved? Are you really a Christian? Just ask yourself "Does the world hate me?" The word "Christian" means "Christ-follower"... Are you truly a Christ-follower? Do you do what He has commanded all of us to do? Have you gone where He has commanded all of us to go? Is He really Lord to you? (Your Master, Boss, King, and Ruler) Or do you simply call Him "Lord, Lord..." when, in fact, He has never even known you?
Have you really repented (turned away) from your sin? Have you ever put to death your own will to submit to His authority? Or are you still on good terms with your sin... or with the sinners? Here's a little tip for you; If the sinners love you or your message (or lack of one)... you are either NOT preaching the Gospel at all, or you are following and proclaiming an anti-Christ false gospel!
To millions, it feels good to be able to say "I'm a Christian" without having to lay down their sin in repentance? What about you? Does the world still see you as one of the "majority", the loving, quiet, non offensive "Christians". Or have they seen your "true colors" as one who is "in Christ", following Him, serving Him, and, yes, obeying Him. If so, the Bible says that the world will come to hate you!
If you are now "that born again guy" to them, they won't ever be able to see you as you were to them before. As one of the "minority" on the narrow path to Life, I want the "negative image" of the Gospel to block the "positive image" of the sinful life. I want to be hated for "spewing" the intolerant Word of God, the "message of offense"(1 Peter 2:8), the True Gospel of Jesus Christ.
In one way, I'm striving to be like "Dog" Chapman & Michael Richards! How? In creating situations where the world doesn't see the "old me" anymore,... fun, comfortable, ol' buddy, and pal to the world... but constantly praying that the world always sees what I have become in Christ... and always praying that the Words I speak will offend them until they turn in true repentance and faith to Jesus Christ!
_____________________________________________
MY FIRST E-MAIL TO PASTOR STRADER:
The "Open Letter"...
From: jon@thewaycf.com
To: karlajoy@aol.com
Sent: 5/26/2008 1:48:06 P.M.
Subj: Pastor Stephen Strader - 2 questions...
Pastor Stephen Strader,
I am in the process of determining the Assemblies of God current position concerning previous Official Statements and their official view of Todd Bentley. Out of 5 letters I have sent (to Dr. George Wood, Terry Raburn, Steve Hill, John Kilpatrick and AG Public Relations Director Keith Surface) I have only received a response from Pastor John Kilpatrick. But I am not satisfied with his statement as it answers no questions concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine and what the Assemblies of God congregations should do with it. (i.e., ignore it, condemn it, or support it)
I've been in church all of my life. Every minister I have ever known took such a high view of doctrine and their ministry/pulpit responsibilities that they would never allow ANYONE to preach from their pulpit without first finding out what they believe. Yet (as one of our commenters believed) John Kilpatrick, at least, was "reverse-duped" and tricked into speaking at Todd Bentley's pulpit without knowing HIS doctrine.
Pastor Kilpatrick issued this statement in response to my e-mail about the Lakeland Revival:
I, John Kilpatrick, went down to Todd Bentley’s meetings, the Florida Outpouring, and gave my blessing to revival. I made it clear that I didn’t know Todd, his doctrinal belief nor who he is affiliated with, if anyone. To me, doctrine is very important. It always has been and it always will be. It is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine.
The purpose of my going to Lakeland was to bless what God was doing. I continue to champion and pray that it stands the test of time.
John A. Kilpatrick
My concern is, how could Pastor Kilpatrick, a man who claims to holds doctrine so highly, (and I believe he does) do something like stand in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring" as a man and move of God?
Also, how can you, in maintaining an Assemblies of God church, host, sponsor, and support Todd Bentley and his unbiblical (as the Assemblies of God have previously declared) ministry?
In the end there are only three options I can see why Pastors John Kilpatrick and Steve Hill and yourself might stand in front of possibly millions of people to bless Todd Bentley and the "Florida Outpouring"...
(1) You (they) are going against the AoG Position Papers and over 50 years of refusing to support the Latter Rain movement by the Assemblies of God thus accepting the "Latter Rain" doctrines of Todd Bentley.
(2) You (they) do NOT hold doctrine or the issue of another man's "doctrine" nearly as highly as you (they) should (and which Pastor Kilpatrick's response says he does). At least not high enough to check out Todd Bentley's doctrine in advance of hosting, sponsoring, supporting and appearing on stage with him.
(3) You (they) were drugged, kidnapped, led to the revival by force, and forced to host Todd Bentley and to speak and pray on that stage.
I want to believe Pastor Kilpatrick when he says that he holds doctrine in high regard, but I can't when he was thoughtless enough to put himself in front of the world (on satellite camera) to say "This is a move of God..." and "I bless you (Todd) in Jesus' name, that this thing (Todd's revival) would go worldwide" when Todd Bentley's doctrine is so completely unbiblical.
I have also heard you spend a great deal of time on television and internet video defending Todd Bentley and this revival as a move of God. The only problem is that you can't defend that position by scripture.
Pastor Kilpatrick said in his statement to me that doctrine "is the infrastructure that a move of God runs on. You can not separate a man from his doctrine." I agree. But there has been easy-to-find, ample evidence documented about Todd Bentley's doctrines and "Latter Rain" associations for quite some time and they should have alarmed all of you to the truth.
This statement sounds to me like Pastor Kilpatrick is attempting to say that he knew NOTHING of Todd Bentley's doctrine...and that's my point!
And that's why he, yourself, Pastor Steve Hill, Terry Raburn, and Dr. George Wood should now "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches and say:
"I made a mistake. I was duped. (if applicable) I do not support Todd Bentley's ministry. I stand with the Assemblies of God General Council of 1949 and the Resolution 16 Position Papers in taking a bold stand against any of Todd Bentley's "Latter Rain/Joel's Army" doctrines. And I, Steve Hill & John Kilpatrick were wrong to go on his stage, support him, promote him and host him."
And it is time NOW for the Assemblies of God to pull themselves OUT of this unbiblical movement that is claiming to be "of God" yet is mixed and mingled with heresies and heretics, false prophecies and false prophets, false teachings and false teachers, and worst of all, a leader who (by his own words) makes Jesus Christ of less concern than the "the supernatural"... and He says God told him to do it!
Or maybe you, Pastor Strader are a full Todd Bentley/Latter Rain supporter. If so, I believe you should "fess up" to the worldwide members of Assembly of God churches that you have accepted as authentic that which the Assemblies of God has historically called unbiblical. Then the many who still hold dearly the Holy Word of God and the past godly resolutions of the Assemblies of God can have a final word. Until you make a statement, tens of thousands of your members are confused. This revival DOES NOT line up with scripture, its leader DOES NOT line up with scripture, his mentors, BOB JONES, JACK COE, WILLIAM BRANHAM, A.A. ALLEN etc. etc., who DO NOT line up with scripture, and, some of which, the Assemblies of God have in the past refused to associate with, or the Assemblies of God have taken away AG credentials from.
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley, because he is basically saying "What the AG formerly said is false. These are men of God! These are moves of God! These are the words of God!" etc, etc,
The Assembly of God congregations and pastors MUST know where you stand in relation to Todd Bentley so they can decide whether they will go along with the NEW Assemblies of God, or continue to agree with the OLD Assemblies of God and deem it unbiblical, and get out.
I only have two questions and I would like you to answer them in response to this e-mail...
1. Do you, Stephen Strader agree with and stand behind the official statements of the Assemblies of God General Councils of 1949 and in Resolution 16 at General Council 2000 concerning the Latter Rain movement and End Time Revival, which both condemned the Latter Rain movement and its doctrines as unbiblical?
These doctrines include:
• The overemphasis on identifying, bestowing, or imparting spiritual gifts by the laying on of hands and naming, supposedly by prophecy, specific gifts.
• The problematic teaching that present-day offices of apostles and prophets should govern church ministry at all levels. and "The erroneous teaching that the church is built on the foundation of present-day apostles and prophets"
• "The extreme teaching... of confession of sin to man and deliverance as practiced, which claims prerogatives to human agency which belongs only to Christ"
• The practice of imparting or imposing personal leadings by means of gifts of utterance.
• Wresting and distorting Scripture through interpretations that are in opposition to the primary meaning of biblical passages.
• Kingdom Now or Dominion theology.
• Manifest Sons of God and Joel’s Army
• Spiritualizing Biblical Events and History
• The Prosperity Gospel
• Birthing
• Generational Curses
• Excessive fixation on Satan and demonic spirits
• Excessive Fascination With Physical "Manifestations
[ ] I AGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
[ ] I DISAGREE with the statements of AGGC (1949 and 2000) concerning the Latter Rain Movement and End-Time Revival.
2. Do you, Stephen Strader, officially consider Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry (as documented in his many teachings, videos etc) as straight (II Timothy 2:15), and consistently in line with the Word of God?
[ ] I believe Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry are BIBLICAL
[ ] I believe Todd Bentley's doctrines and ministry are IN ERROR
Two simple questions. I would be satisfied and would have no further questions for you if I could get you to answer those two simple questions.
And I believe that the entire Assemblies of God denomination deserves to hear those answers so that they may be led out of confusion!
I eagerly await your response. If I do not receive one within 72 hours I will take it upon myself to begin a campaign and will do all I can to get the word out about the contradictions of the National Headquarters from 1948, to 2000, to today, to the AG churches and pastors of the world so they can make an informed, biblical decision about Todd Bentley.
I sincerely hope you decide to clear this question up for me, for all of my readers, and for the world, even though you will be criticized by some. And I sincerely hope you are still willing to "wear that criticism gladly as a sign of fidelity to Christ" like you said you would at General Council in 2000!
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
blog.thewaycf.com
_____________________________________________________________________
PASTOR STRADER'S FIRST RESPONSE FOLLOWS:
From: pastor@ignitedchurch.com
To: jon@thewaycf.com.com
Sent: 5/26/2008 3:53:06 P.M.
Subj: Re: Pastor Stephen Strader - 2 questions...
Jon
I'm very sorry... I just don't have the time to answer all of your questions or concerns...
I guarantee that if you had three A/G pastors in a room, somebody would be in disagreement with something one of the other two is doing.
This is NOT about the A/G or Todd or me... this is a God thing... I don't "own it" nor can I "control it"
I think the mistakes of the A/G is that they "threw out the baby with the bath water" when they renounced the "latter rain" outpouring. I think they made "blanket statements" that condemned the whole bunch because of a few "bad apples"...
None of us wants to make that same mistake again.
The A/G made those statements "years" after the movement was started... today is only day 55... do you understand that WE don't even understand what is happening???
Todd and I have discussed many doctrinal "adjustments" that he has made over his ten years of ministry -- just like any man of God -- he is constantly adjusting...
as of TODAY -- Todd has said or done nothing that is in direct conflict with any A/G doctrine. He has had "guests" on the platform that would not be acceptable, but "those guests" are just "guests" and Todd and myself are leading this as best we can.
Have you ever watched Fox News have a "panel debate" over a "speech" given by the President??? Those speeches have been "thought out" worked on by specialists... lawyers... politicians... etc... EVERYTHING we are doing on that stage is PURE SPONTANEOUS... it's like trying to "ride a bull"...
There are been many mistakes... we make adjustments and get back on the bull the next day... PLEASE -- PRAY FOR US -- this is NOT the time to "dissect" this or "analyze this"... We need your prayers and encouragement.
Do you remember when the hurricane hit New Orleans? You had people DEMANDING to know "why" there were people in the super dome not being cared for... they wanted answers... that wasn't the time to ask "why"... it was TIME TO GET THEM HELP...
We need HELP... not questions...
Stephen Strader
pastor@ignitedchurch.com
www.ignitedchurch.com
_____________________________________________________________________
MY SECOND E-MAIL TO PASTOR STRADER:
From: jon@thewaycf.com
To: pastor@ignitedchurch.com
Sent: 5/27/2008 8:05:06 P.M.
Subj: my previous e-mail...
Sir,
First, I would like to thank you sincerely for responding so quickly to my e-mail. I know you are unbelievably busy. I do want you to know that I do not have malicious intents in this "campaign".
However, the doctrines being taught by Todd Bentley (and that have been taught, and that are still posted on his freshfire.ca website) are clearly against the Word of God. I have no choice but to stand against it and warn others to stay away.
You wrote... "He (Todd) has had "guests" on the platform that would not be acceptable (by AoG Standards), but "those guests" are just "guests" and Todd and myself are leading this as best we can."
Unfortunately, Todd's guests ARE your guests... and guests of the Assemblies of God via Ignited Church. What does "leadership" mean if not keeping heretics off your stage? And if they are unacceptable to the AoG, then you, Pastor Strader, should be reprimanded by Springfield for hosting these "unacceptable guests"! But I suppose Springfield is not worried about their "flock" judging from the letter I received from Dr. Wood. LINK That saddens me since the teachings of the "guests" that you mentioned you have hosted on the platform are flat-out heretical in several cases as are Mr. Bentley's ideas of the natures and personalities of God, Jesus Christ, and The Holy Spirit.
You said "as of TODAY -- Todd has said or done nothing that is in direct conflict with any A/G doctrine."
That is very much debatable, and the silence of any prominent AG leader thus far concerning Todd Bentley's doctrine also worries me greatly about the spiritual health of the denomination!
Finally, you said "Do you remember when the hurricane hit New Orleans? You had people DEMANDING to know "why" there were people in the super dome not being cared for... they wanted answers... that wasn't the time to ask "why"... it was TIME TO GET THEM HELP... We need HELP... not questions..."
My response is "How many more souls would have died without the questions being raised?" Questions are what create solutions. Unfortunately for the "revival", questions also bring out the Truth.
Pastor Strader, NOW IS the time to ask biblical questions and make hard biblical choices to help "save the people blown by every wind of doctrine" both from this mess now, and from future " hurricane winds" of false revival. To "Wait and See" what is left standing and who is left alive after the storm blows over is the WRONG MOVE! People are being blown to destruction by way of Todd's unbiblical "Winds of Change" mess.
You said that you needed "Prayers and Encouragement"... I believe we should ALL oblige you. I am praying for you. I am praying for Todd Bentley. And I am praying for all others involved and the thousands of people who are being led into deception by way of the "Florida Outpouring". It is an unbiblical move of a false angel/god, being led by a biblically-false prophet and a false teacher.
Therefore the one thing I can't pray for is the success of this "revival".
As for encouragement, I can't offer to hold your arms up in this case because I believe you are fighting the wrong side of the war!
However, with all sincerity, I ENCOURAGE YOU, and Todd Bentley, and everyone else involved with this "outpouring", to dump the watered-down message that is being "preached". As a rule, it has been consistently falling outside the written, revealed Word of God. The world does not need healing. They need salvation. They don't need "electricity", they need the definition of the Power of God (Dunamis) that the Bible gives time and time again... the Gospel of Jesus Christ IS the "Power of God".
You have before you the greatest opportunity anyone has had in hundreds of years! You have a worldwide audience. Now *IS* the ONLY time you will have to dissect and analyze this...
I ENCOURAGE YOU to examine what has been going forth... and as Pastor, make sure that the watered down message that has been being preached is replaced with the concentrated, pure stuff...
Drop the weak "gospel" of healing, signs, wonders, prosperity and miracles... and preach instead the consistent, clear message of sin, faith, repentance, and salvation/righteousness through Jesus Christ alone.
Miracles and healings will always be worked by God... and souls will always be saved in the same manner... but it all only happens when people begin falling on their faces in repentance, rather than on their backs, wishing for a miracle. I ENCOURAGE YOU, surrender to the will of God, repent from the message you are backing, and fight for Who you know is Right! Stand brave and preach a "Sinners in the hands of an angry God" message! Stand brave and preach the Gospel of Jesus Christ! Stand brave and do what you must with the revival... Only then will lives will be eternally changed. Only through the preaching of His Son and our Savior, Jesus Christ will God will be glorified. And then you will have many who will be scrambling to hold your arms up!
I would sincerely appreciate it if you would share this letter with Todd Bentley, John & Carol Arnott, Patricia King, Bob Jones, Paul Cain, Roy Fields, and anyone else you wish.
Sincerely,
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
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PASTOR STRADER'S SECOND RESPONSE FOLLOWS:
From: Stephen Strader
To: TheWayCF (Jon)
Sent: Tuesday, May 27, 2008 7:58 PM
Subject: Re: My previous letter...
please list the heretics that have been on the stage
I'm not aware of but one... has he has not been invited back
Stephen Strader
pastor@ignitedchurch.com
www.ignitedchurch.com
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MY THIRD E-MAIL TO PASTOR STRADER:
On May 28, 2008, at 3:25 AM, Totally Sharp (Jon) wrote:
Pastor Strader,
The fact that Paul Cain was invited in the first place is the problem. The damage has been done so it doesn't matter whether that he won't be invited back.
FIRST: Would you not consider Patricia King a heretic?
(Patricia King has never backed down from calling her "Great Cloud of Witnesses" experience "truth"... but has only said that she would stop selling it.)
She said: "I am not admitting error in any of the content I have shared. A full theological review will determine this in the future. But, I am very sorry for communicating it in wrong timing, in an unwise manner, and perhaps to wrong audiences who were not ready or able to process and sift through the concepts and revelations."
and elsewhere (on her website)...
"Patricia has personally never spoken to anyone in the Great Cloud of Witnesses and she does not believe that we are to call for them (BUT THEY CAN "CALL US"?)
http://extremeprophetic.com/ask_patricia_pg1.htm(BUT IF THEY START A CONVERSATION, ITS OK?) She has, however had a visionary encounter on two occasions which involved the Great Cloud of Witnesses. Hebrews 12:1 says they "surround us.” She is not sure what Todd believes about the Great Cloud of Witnesses releasing mantles or empowerment. Patricia has come to no conclusions on that subject herself..."
SECOND: Would you not consider Bob Jones a heretic?
Bob Jones says that God's question for entrance into heaven is that "Have you learned to love?"... And if you HAVEN"T, don't worry, some still "get in" but with no fruit. I'm not sure what those who went to hell in his vision did to deserve it.
(He also says) his hands started "working funny" (turning colors and having healing properties) after a bolt of blue lightning came into his basement?
Bob Jones seems to be saying that healing gifts come from encounters with lightning... and that the Blood of Christ is trumped by "love for brethren" in satisfying God's wrath? Sounds like heresy to me.
THIRD: Unfortunately, I believe this is pure heresy from Todd Bentley himself... not to mention other issues from his past/current website "teachings" AND the fact that he constantly refers to heretics, false prophets, drunks, etc of the past as people he emulates and admires.
In fact, you are in close proximity to Mr. Bentley... Would you please (and I'm serious) ask him why he removed references to the angel's name of "Emma" from his website,... or give me his e-mail address and I would be glad to ask him myself.
Please reply to explain how any of these are not heresies. It concerns me greatly that you don't see them as such.
Thank you for the dialog.
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
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PASTOR STRADER'S THIRD RESPONSE FOLLOWS:
From: Stephen Strader
To: TheWayCF(Jon)
Sent: Wednesday, May 28, 2008 7:54 AM
Subject: Re: My previous letter...
Jon
I have sat and discussed all of these with all three... I am satisfied that they were on a journey, they experienced some things... they have sought wise - theological counsel - they have and continue to make adjustments -- and -- as far as I am concerned today -- they are not and have not taught anything that is heretical.
For example -- the whole "emma" experience happened seven years ago... Todd went through a thorough year of a "sabbatical" two years ago when he focused his faith & theology... and that's when he pulled those things from his website... some additional things were on his website -- discovered by critics -- and he had those pulled as well.
Another example -- there are examples of "saints" appearing to people in the bible -- but Todd nor I believe that we should ever "seek" to experience those things... we can "seek" to experience what John the Revelatory experienced in Revelation... but it certainly is not a "casual" or "common" every - day experience...
The bottom line is Todd, Patricia, and Bob Jones are "out there" -- pushing the envelope of faith... they are not "theologians"... and they receive "correction" from righteous brothers in the Lord... I know this first hand.
This ATTENTION that they are receiving right now has forced them on a journey of theology and doctrine... and I personally give you my word that they are making correction.
Will they "satisfy" your doctrine... probably not... maybe not even mine... but what I do know beyond any shadow of a doubt... they truly love Jesus -- Christ is the center and focus of their lives... and they are living right...
The word says -- let every man work out his salvation with fear and trembling...
Of course I'm responsible for what happens in my pulpit... and my pulpit is clean as far as I know. I have corrected anything that I have felt uncomfortable with including Bob Jones mentioning "emma"... and Todd agreed with me and talked with Bob about it... it won't happen again.
Jon... if you and I were having a discussion with a Southern Baptist... they would not agree with anything other than the blood & the cross... they read the same bible and they just choose to ignore the work of the Holy Spirit, signs & wonders, and miracles. I don't want to be like that... I want to be open to the move of the Spirit.
The bible says -- by their fruits you shall know them... I am seeing & experiencing incredible fruit... I do not see people running around having "angelic" experiences or "talking" with dead saints... I see people having a first hand experience with Christ and His Holy Spirit -- period... no exceptions... so far.
New Converts are being won... we are developing a followup that is based on biblical discipleship... and it comes right out of A/G doctrine...
What more can I say? If you choose to "throw this outpouring out" because of past mistakes or possible heresy's of people loosely connected... you will be missing the work of the Holy Spirit -- just like the A/G did back in the 50's when they rejected the Latter Rain movement instead of "stewarding" it...
I'm trying to steward this... why do you think I've spent 30 minutes responding to you -- I don't know you -- and I have 1200 unread emails on my computer.
Stephen Strader
pastor@ignitedchurch.com
www.ignitedchurch.com
_________________________________________________________________
MY FOURTH E-MAIL TO PASTOR STRADER:
On May 28, 2008, at 11:29 PM, Totally Sharp (Jon) wrote:
Pastor Strader,
Thank you for your quick reply. I have responded to what you wrote me in BLUE. Your text remains (RED). I wrote more below these responses.... You wrote:
Jon
I have sat and discussed all of these with all three... I am satisfied that they were on a journey, they experienced some things... they have sought wise - theological counsel -
{could you please give me names and positions of some of these wise counselors?}
they have and continue to make adjustments
{to what? personal doctrine and beliefs? or to their recorded words?}
-- and -- as far as I am concerned today have not taught anything that is heretical.
{today?}
For example -- the whole "emma" experience happened seven years ago... Todd went through a thorough year of a "sabbatical" two years ago when he focused his faith & theology... and that's when he pulled those things from his website...
{so does he no longer believe the angel's name was Emma?... or does he believe the experience never happened?... because the account remains on his website. Yet the name Emma has disappeared}
some additional things were on his website
{has he changed his views on those "additional things" as being "biblical" or "from God"... or is he just keeping them from public scrutiny yet maintaining the belief?}
-- discovered by critics -- and he had those pulled as well.
Another example -- there are examples of "saints" appearing to people in the bible -- but Todd nor I believe that we should ever "seek" to experience those things... we can "seek" to experience what John the Revelatory experienced in Revelation... but it certainly is not a "casual" or "common" every-day experience...
{ It seems to be an every-day experience for Todd Bentley - by his statements I see that he has regular access if not daily access to an open portal to heaven and God speaks DIRECTLY verbally to him near daily, if I am to believe his statements on the many nights of services I've watched}
The bottom line is Todd, Patricia, and Bob Jones are "out there" -- pushing the envelope of faith...
{sir, they are "pushing the envelope" of the Word of God -- to their own destruction! The phrase means "To exceed the existing limits in a certain field;... Well, GOD set the limits. Who are Todd Bentley, Bob Jones and Patricia King to "push" God's limits?}
they are not "theologians"
{definition: a person versed in the field of study and analysis ...of God and of God's attributes and relations to the universe; study of divine things or religious truth; RELIGIOUS TRUTH does not come from seminary-- it comes from the Bible. If they are not theologians as the Bereans were, why should we want them teaching us or our loved ones about God, his attributes, or religious truth? I am not a heart surgeon. So I don't do heart surgery! I do study and analyze God's Word, so I preach it.}
..and they receive "correction" from righteous brothers in the Lord... I know this first hand.
{Could you please give me the names and positions of some of these righteous brothers?}
This ATTENTION that they are receiving right now has forced them on a journey of theology and doctrine... and I personally give you my word that they are making correction.
{Yet they are teaching others daily the same stuff that they are soon going to have to "correct"?? They should not be on stage yet if they are in the middle of this unsure journey to find what they believe!}
Will they "satisfy" your doctrine... probably not... maybe not even mine... but what I do know beyond any shadow of a doubt... they truly love Jesus -- Christ is the center and focus of their lives...
{Then why is Jesus NOT the center and focus of the "Florida Outpouring"? Todd talks about Jesus at most 1/20th of the time that he talks about everything else... I know... I've counted it up.}
and they are living right...
{I assume you mean morally... I have no reason to doubt it. And I have personally never said anything or written anything about tattoos, dress, criminal records, piercings, etc. They don't matter to me. All I care about is that the Gospel of Jesus Christ, crucified and resurrected, is the message Todd preaches... on television he has failed.}
The word says -- let every man work out his salvation with fear and trembling...
{Sir, you are misusing this verse - it does not mean "figure things out"...
Philippians 2:1-2 (NLT) Is there any encouragement from belonging to Christ? Any comfort from his love? Any fellowship together in the Spirit? Are your hearts tender and compassionate? Then make me truly happy by agreeing wholeheartedly with each other, loving one another, and working together with one mind and purpose.
Philippians 2:5 You must have the same attitude that Christ Jesus had.
Philippians 2:7 ...he took the humble position of a slave...
Philippians 2:8-13 ...he humbled himself in obedience to God and died a criminal’s death on a cross. Therefore, God elevated him to the place of highest honor and gave him the name above all other names, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Dear friends, you always followed my instructions when I was with you. And now that I am away, it is even more important. Work hard to show (((in context, this means to "push OUT" in full view of the world what God has "WORKED IN" you))) the results of your salvation, obeying God with deep reverence and fear. For God is working in you, giving you the desire and the power to do what pleases him...
So GOD does it ALL by working in us... We can't "work anything out" concerning our salvation.}
Of course I'm responsible for what happens in my pulpit... and my pulpit is clean as far as I know. I have corrected anything that I have felt uncomfortable with including Bob Jones mentioning "emma"... and Todd agreed with me and talked with Bob about it... it won't happen again.
{Frankly I don't care what you, or I, or any other pastor is "uncomfortable" with... our "hearts are deceitfully wicked"... I only care that we judge all words and deeds by the Word of God.
Once we take liberties to venture outside his revealed Word looking for "truth" we have no limits. Suppose Bob Jones said that he had a picnic on the moon with the prophet Daniel, Elvis Presley and 12 little green cheese men. Who am I or who are you to doubt him?
If we don't have a RULE by which to measure ALL things, then anybody can say anything and we have no way to refute it! II Timothy 3:16 says ALL Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be COMPLETE, thoroughly equipped for EVERY good work.}
Jon... if you and I were having a discussion with a Southern Baptist... they would not agree with anything other than the blood & the cross... they read the same bible and they just choose to ignore the work of the Holy Spirit, signs & wonders, and miracles. I don't want to be like that... I want to be open to the move of the Spirit.
{Me too. But any "move" MUST be measured, judged, and limited by the Scriptures. The minute it falls outside the bounds of the Bible, we must call it ERROR.
Bob DeWaay gives this illustration about "putting God in a box". He says that's the wrong perspective. We DON'T put God in a box... he has already put us safely in a sheepfold. And the fenceline of that sheepfold is the Word of God! Outside the "hedge of protection" he has graciously given are the "wolves" and the "lion seeking to devour us"
How can we know with assurance whether Bob Jones or Todd Bentley or Patricia King is a wolf in sheeps clothing??
By YOUR ASSURANCE TO ME?
By PATRICIA KING'S STATEMENT ON HER TV SHOW?
By THE WORD of TODD?....
No..... these things are only measurable by the Word of God!}
The bible says -- by their fruits you shall know them... I am seeing & experiencing incredible fruit...
{Each individual "fruit" of the Spirit is commonly counterfeited even by cult leaders like Jim Jones and psychopaths like Hitler. The true "fruit of the Spirit is singular" Love-Joy-Peace-Patience-Kindness-Goodness-Gentleness-Self Control, this singular "fruit" comes from a singular "Holy Spirt" and is the evidence that you are a "seed-bearing" plant. The ONLY eternal fruit of a believer are the souls which he has a part in reaching with the Gospel...}
I do not see people running around having "angelic" experiences or "talking" with dead saints... I see people having a first hand experience with Christ and His Holy Spirit -- period... no exceptions... so far.
New Converts are being won... we are developing a followup that is based on biblical discipleship... and it comes right out of A/G doctrine...
{I'm not saying people aren't hearing the Gospel, I'm not saying no one is being saved. I'm saying everytime I have watched on television there has been (1) a near-worthless attempt at presenting of the Gospel or (2) NO presentation of the Gospel... maybe it is happening before or after you are "on-air". Please tell me if I am wrong... I hope I am.}
What more can I say? If you choose to "throw this outpouring out" because of past mistakes or possible heresy's of people loosely connected... you will be missing the work of the Holy Spirit
{The same Spirit that raised Christ from the dead DWELLS IN ME... How can I "miss his work"?}
-- just like the A/G did back in the 50's when they rejected the Latter Rain movement instead of "stewarding" it... I'm trying to steward this...
{1 Corinthians 4:2: "IT IS REQUIRED IN STEWARDS, THAT A MAN BE FOUND FAITHFUL - How but by the Word of God can you say that you have been faithful or not? How but by the Word of God can you even attempt to steward this movement? I believe the A/G did the right thing in the 50's according to the Word of God.
why do you think I've spent 30 minutes responding to you -- I don't know you -- and I have 1200 unread emails on my computer.
Stephen Strader
Pastor Strader, Though it appears we disagree on vital issues I VERY SINCERELY appreciate you taking the time for me. It greatly encourages me that at least SOMEONE in the A/G organization was concerned enough to deal with at least some questions and honestly I least expected that it would be you.
As I said, I am praying for you, for Todd and for all of your visitors. I am praying for you... that you can remain faithful to the Word of God. I am praying that you keep yourself INSIDE God's sheepfold of His Word so that that you will not deceived by the wolves to come out.
Please know that I desire revival as well... I'm just sad that we seem to have different definitions of the word.
I pray that God will bless you and reveal his Truth to you by His Spirit through His Word (in that laptop on your lap?) ;)
Isa 8:19 And when they say to you, “Seek those who are mediums and wizards, who whisper and mutter,” should not a people seek their God?
Should they seek the dead on behalf of the living? To the law and to the testimony! (GODS WORD) If they do not speak according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.
Please respond with a note even if you don't have time to deal with the above points. I would like to know if you would have any problem with me posting these correspondences on my blog.
It really is kind of you to engage me in this discussion and I believe you have answered some questions my readers probably have.
I hope you know that I am sincerely not being malicious toward any but simply defending the Word of God against what I believe are huge problems with the Florida Outpouring.
I am of no denomination so I have no one to answer to but God and I take that position very seriously. If I don't "do what I know is right" to me it would be sin.
In Christ,
Jon Sharp
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PASTOR STRADER'S FOURTH RESPONSE FOLLOWS:
Jon
I'm so sorry...
I have over 1500 unread emails just from the last few days...
If you don't "believe" then delete this... there is no answer that will calm your doubts...
If you have the Holy Spirit... simply pray... "Lord, if there is anything here that you want me to have, then I want it... anything you don't want me to have, then keep it from me..."
See what God does for you
I believe that Todd and this Outpouring are from God... it's the Lord's doing... period.
It will NEVER be perfect... nor will the "doctrine" line up with everyone... let the Holy Spirit sort it out!!!
Stephen Strader
pastor@ignitedchurch.com
www.ignitedchurch.com
___________________________________________________
MY FIFTH (and final) E-MAIL TO PASTOR STRADER:
Sir,
Thank you so much for all of your time. These e-mails will help give some official "equal time" to you, Ignited Church and the "Florida Outpouring" on my blog.
I very much appreciate the answers you gave when no one else seemed to want to deal with these questions. I'm sincerely praying for you.
Jon Sharp
END OF POST